Why the world is rooted.

[brian ross]

And yet you want to attack all Muslims because a handful refuse to shake hands, 4th.

How do you know how many Muslims refuse to shake hands and how many don't? You assert that it's "a handful" yet provide no credible data that backs up your assertion. Speculation is worthless.

Besides, my criticism is for (1) immigrants who expect their new country to change its customs to suit their own, and (2) nations that cave to such demands by amending their own long-held customs.

1. I have never encountered a Muslim who refused to shake hands and I have, I don't doubt, encountered more Muslims than you have, 4th.
2. Nations change their customs and their attitudes when they feel a need or a desire to. It is a choice of their citizens as individuals. No custom is so sacrosanct that it cannot be changed.

First, let us make one thing clear, I am talking about LEGAL migrants, not ILLEGAL migrants. You appear to want to discuss ILLEGAL immigrants, which I don't. Why? 'cause they have entered your country illegally. Legal migrants enter your country, well legally. There is a huge difference to how either is treated compared to the other, you realise? So, let us limit our discussion to LEGAL immigrants (and that BTW, includes Asylum Seekers who are legally allowed to enter and stay in the USA).

Why should I suddenly allow you to change the subject to legal migrants when the OP clearly referred to "Europe's escalating migrant crisis" and made the point that "European countries are being swamped by immigrants/refugees/economic wanderers/asylum seekers" and "just look at the problem on the US southern border"?

Because it is what I am discussing, not what the OP is discussing, 4th. You want a discussion with me, you have to play by rules that I agree with. Oh, and the last time I checked, "Asylum Seekers" are legal migrants...

Sorry, no goal post moving in the middle of the football game!

I wasn't aware we were playing football, 4th.

Well first up, it is not the whole society that is being asked to amend it's customs, it is individuals who are being asked. I would have suggest that out of common courtesy, when an individual offers a handshake and that is refused, say by a Japanese person (see it's not only Muslims who refuse handshakes), the person requested not to shake hands, does so without complaint. Otherwise, they are just being rude.

Now you're wandering off the trail. The subject isn't individuals being asked to change their customs; it's governments conforming to the customs of immigrant minorities.

Where is that being asked, 4th? Sure it isn't your imagination playing a roll here? An imagination fueled by Islamophobia?

Again, the OP referred to the Totaljobs website and the possibility of handshake customs in the UK changing to suit Muslims. And lo and behold, what should I find on the Totaljobs website? Why, this story about a "Swedish Muslim woman [who] has won compensation after her job interview with a translation company was swiftly ended when she declined to shake hands with a male interviewer." https://www.personneltoday.com/hr/job-interview/

As the story reads: "Earlier this week a Swedish labour court ruled that Semantix should pay her 40,000 krona (£3,420) in compensation ... The court heard that Alhajeh 'adheres to an interpretation of Islam that prohibits handshaking with the opposite sex unless it is a close member of the family.'”

Bingo ... a classic example of what the OP and I were talking about: A government court rules against the time-honored customs of a company (and nation) and in favor of the customs of an immigrant minority.

Again, a case of individuals asking that their customs be observed, nothing more. Nothing that actually suggests that there be an official government position undertaken on this. I'd suggest that the Muslim woman was perfectly correct to seek compensation after the job interview was ended because she refused to shake hands. Everybody is different, everybody has different customs. In my previous post I named two other nationalities that don't shake hands. Should they also be penalised? Should hand shaking become an official policy, 4th? Should be all people be forced to conform to your narrow minded viewpoint?

And by the way, if you're going to take Black Orchid to task for using the wrong word, be prepared to get similarly admonished when you use "it's customs" in an sentence that clearly requires the word "its." The sentence calls for a possessive in this case, not a contraction.

I have merely suggested a correction as yes, she did use the wrong word. I suppose I could just start calling you a "septic," and you'd be happy with that? Afterall, it is an Australian custom and you wouldn't like to change Australian customs on an Australian website, now would you?

If I come requesting mercy and I am accepted by a society, I expect that I will be allowed to, within reason, practice my own culture and my own religion. I do not expect to instantly, just add water, become an American. Would you expect to become an Australian overnight if you migrated to Australia or sought Asylum from the harsh el Presidente' Trump's regime?

You're making my point for me. I would never expect Australia or its companies to change their customs to suit my preferences, no. So i wouldn't immediately expect the government to compensate me for the lack of American rules football games available to attend.

American rules is played downunder, your saved!

No, I expect you'll just get upset when you don't have a Primary to vote in and that voting downunder is by Preference Voting, rather than First-past-the-post methods. Oh, and you can't own a gun for self-defence purposes nor can you have a semi-automatic longarm or a pump-action shotgun. I'm sure you'll be heart broken.

You will be able to shake hands though, except of course with the people from cultures which don't...

As a legal migrant or asylum seeker, I am more like a neighbour than a "guest", 4th. As I would intend to become an American citizen ASAP, I would be accorded the same respect and the same rights as any other American citizen. Or are migrants/Asylum Seekers, considered second-class citizens in the USA?

What do you mean, "any OTHER American citizen"? Illegal migrants/asylum seekers are not citizens at all, so they don't even deserve to be considered second-class citizens. Do you not understand that a person who sneaks across a border does not automatically become a citizen of the country he sets foot in?

We aren't discussing illegal immigrants, 4e. Well, I'm not. I'm not sure what you're talking about...

My point was that immigrants have no right to expect their new country to change its time-honored customs just to accommodate their tastes.

The immigrants do not expect that in the slightest. What they expect is their customs to be honoured just as much as the established citizens', 4th. America is made up of many cultures, it is made up of many religions, it is made up of many "races" and ethnicities. America is a compromise between them all. You appear unwilling to compromise about shaking hands. Silly you.

I call B.S. -- as the story from Sweden demonstrates, some immigrants not only expect their new nation to conform to their customs; they expect to be compensated financially when a company in their new nation fails to do so. Silly YOU.
[/quote]

Sweden always leads the way, hey, 4e? How about say, Australia or Canada or Japan or China or India or Brazil or Argentina or New Zealand? Do they count more than lonely little Sweden?

Immaterial. Your country is still not "full", 4th. You really need to learn to read, don't you? There are hundreds of thousands of square miles of unoccupied land in the USA. Cities are emptying in some places. You don't think it would be a good idea to actually allow in citizens who want to settle there?

Speaking of learning to read, where did you get the idea that migrants/asylum seekers were citizens?

Because they have no prefacing word to their classification, 4e. They are not Illegal Migrants or Illegal Asylum Seekers (indeed, you cannot have according to International Law an illegal Asylum Seeker). They are just ordinary, everyday, legal migrants or Asylum Seekers. You do understand the difference? Or has America abandoned the use of common English terms completely?

I couldn't care less how much open space there is in America. We already accept more than a million legal immigrants a year; the last thing we should feel obligated to do is take in more of them, especially when they're a financial burden to the citizens who actually live here.

I wasn't aware that Migrants or Asylum seekers were a financial burden on anyone, 4e. Would you care to explain to us how Migrants or Asylum Seekers are a financial burden on the US Economy? I was under the impression that Migrants or Asylum Seekers came to a new country to settle and and to work there, supporting themselves, like all other long-term residents or Citizens (you do understand the term "long-term residents"?).

I am sure I could do a better job than el Presidente' Trump. I suspect anybody could, if they wanted to...

Sure, let me know the next time you demonstrate an aptitude for implementing policies that raise America's GDP from the anemic 1.8 percent left by Obama to the robust 3.2 percent just measured in the first quarter of 2019.

Sure, I will. Of course you realise that el Presidente Trump's efforts are all short-term, rather than longer term growth, don't you, 4e?

Numbers? Oh, it all boils down to numbers does it, 4th? How many are allowed in now? How many want to enter the US? Answer those questions and I will provide an answer to yours.

"How many want to enter the U.S.?"
Millions, maybe billions.

"How many are allowed in now?"
Good grief, do you not know how to follow a simple link? I gave you one that shows how many immigrants were allowed into the U.S. per year. Here's the link again; if you still can't figure out what to do with it, see if your local zoo has a chimp who's not too busy to show you.
https://read.oecd-ilibrary.org/social-i ... -en#page24

Ah, so generalisations are allowed, are they, 4e?

[billy the kid]

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/us-museum- ... -painting/

We cant have anything denigrating islam.... the dregs of humanity... now can we....you know..those that pose as humans....

[billy the kid]

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-04- ... g-citizens

Question....how do you totally root a country (Sweden) that is already totally rooted...
Answer....allow the scum of the earth (returning isis fighters) to come back home and join the other islamic dregs of society....
Im not sure if the scum of the earth simply become the dregs of humanity when they return...
I tend to think that there isnt much of a difference...
But in all seriousness, Europe, the UK, Sweden, and any other country in Europe has been rooted for decades.....
compliments of incompetent politicians and the infestation of islam like a cancer to all mankind.

"Giving a new definition to the term “Stockholm Syndrome”, Swedish officials are openly contradicting themselves – claiming they’ve interviewed and talked with returning ISIS fighters to ensure they are living a peaceful, modernized life when it’s been reported they’ve lost track of the majority of them.

In their bid to reach total and complete political correctness, yet another European country is putting native citizens in real and actual danger to accommodate migrants with backwards beliefs that only want to terrorize Westernized societies and maim the infidels they’ve declared holy jihad on..."

[Black Orchid]

Funny with an election looming there is a huge silence on who they are bringing back here.

[billy the kid]

Funny with an election looming there is a huge silence on who they are bringing back here.

Oops...lets not forget about Huddersfield....

http://fmshooter.com/more-of-the-same-i ... as-twelve/
...and Telford.....
http://fmshooter.com/stunning-precedent ... ube-video/

Must be difficult for the dregs of humanity to attempt to be human whilst theyre raping everyone......

[billy the kid]

Banaras Hussain of Shipley, is charged with one count of rape of a female over 16.
Banaris Hussain of Huddersfield, is charged with one count of rape of a girl aged 13 – 15.
Mohammed Suhail Arif of Huddersfield, is charged with rape of a girl aged 13-15.
Iftikar Ali of Huddersfield, is charged with attempted rape of girl aged 13-15 and three counts of rape of a girl aged 13-15.
Mohammed Sajjad of Huddersfield, is charged with four counts of rape of a female age 13-15, one rape of a girl under 13 and facilitating the commission of a child sex offence.
Fehreen Rafiq of Huddersfield, she is charged with two counts of facilitating the commission of a child sex offence.
Umar Zaman of Huddersfield, is charged with two counts of rape of a female aged 13-15.
Basharat Hussain of Huddersfield, is charged with two counts of rape of a female aged 13-15.
Amin Ali Choli of Huddersfield, is charged with two counts of rape of a female over 16-years-old.
Shaqeel Hussain of Dewsbury, is charged with rape of a female aged 13-15 and two counts of trafficking.
Mubasher Hussain of Huddersfield, is charged with rape of a female aged 13-15 and sexual assault.
Abdul Majid of Huddersfield, is charged with two counts of rape of female aged 13-15.
Mohammed Dogar of Huddersfield, is charged with two counts of facilitating the commission of child sex offence.
Usman Ali of Huddersfield, is charged with two counts of rape of a female aged 13-15.
Mohammed Waqas Anwar of Huddersfield, is charged with five counts of rape of a female aged 13-15.
Gul Riaz of Huddersfield, is charged with rape of a female aged 13-15.
Mohammed Akram of Huddersfield, is charged with two counts of trafficking with a view to sexual exploitation of a female and rape of a female aged 14-15.
Manzoor Akhtar of Huddersfield, is charged with trafficking and three counts of rape of a female aged 13-15.
Samuel Fikru of Camden, has been charged with two counts of rape of female aged 13-15.
It is not politically incorrect or bigoted to observe that the brunt of those accused are of Muslim-descent. Barring the 12 that remain unnamed, every single man accused of raping and grooming underage girls in Huddersfield is Islamic.

Sadly, a precedent has already been set in regards to Islamic rape gangs sprouting up across the U.K.

[Valkie]

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-04- ... g-citizens

Question....how do you totally root a country (Sweden) that is already totally rooted...
Answer....allow the scum of the earth (returning isis fighters) to come back home and join the other islamic dregs of society....
Im not sure if the scum of the earth simply become the dregs of humanity when they return...
I tend to think that there isnt much of a difference...
But in all seriousness, Europe, the UK, Sweden, and any other country in Europe has been rooted for decades.....
compliments of incompetent politicians and the infestation of islam like a cancer to all mankind.

"Giving a new definition to the term “Stockholm Syndrome”, Swedish officials are openly contradicting themselves – claiming they’ve interviewed and talked with returning ISIS fighters to ensure they are living a peaceful, modernized life when it’s been reported they’ve lost track of the majority of them.

In their bid to reach total and complete political correctness, yet another European country is putting native citizens in real and actual danger to accommodate migrants with backwards beliefs that only want to terrorize Westernized societies and maim the infidels they’ve declared holy jihad on..."

Exactly

Every other culture came to the world bringing value and enrichment

Islam brings nothing but crime, trouble, murder, distrust and welfare fraud.

[billy the kid]

https://www.sbs.com.au/news/jessica-whe ... cial-posts

How absolutely gutless are our politicians.....
Not a word is to be said against muslims or islam.....
We must all zip our mouths, and prove to the world that we are the most
successful multicultural country on the planet....
What a load of garbage....
It all sounds like George Orwells 1984...nothing changes...
Politicians just lie through their teeth whilst trying to keep the lid on everything...
Watch out for the Thought Police everyone...
Dumb em down...thats the way...dumb em down...

[billy the kid]

https://www.jihadwatch.org/2019/05/cana ... -extremism

"Canada is in deep trouble at the hands of an appeasing government which refuses to identify its worst enemies; a government which also lead the charge on the UN Migration Pact, supports open door immigration and has gone so far as to even welcome Islamic State jihadists, because in Trudeau’s mind they can be “a powerful voice for deradicalization”.

Dont ya just love it when politicians omit all references to islamist extremism...as if the world
doesnt recognize islamist extremism is a direct result of the stone age murder cult...

[The4thEstate]

1. I have never encountered a Muslim who refused to shake hands and I have, I don't doubt, encountered more Muslims than you have, 4th.

That's about as scientific as saying, "Gee, I work with a couple of Australians who don't like Vegemite, so I can only conclude that Vegemite is not at all popular in Australia."

2. Nations change their customs and their attitudes when they feel a need or a desire to. It is a choice of their citizens as individuals. No custom is so sacrosanct that it cannot be changed.

Which is the exact opposite of what I've been talking about -- i.e., governments (such as Sweden's) that change longstanding national customs WITHOUT giving citizens a vote in the matter.

And Sweden is just one of many such examples. German citizens never got to vote on Angela Merkel's delusional plan to take in more than a million Islamic refugees. And the citizens of Minneapolis, Minnesota, never got a referendum on whether to admit thousands of Somali refugees into their community.

What a mind-boggling surprise it was when more than 1,000 German women and young girls got sexually assaulted on New Year's Eve 2016. Meanwhile, Minneapolis is now coping with what even lefty NPR dubs "the Somali-Minneapolis terrorist axis." Not to mention antisemitic hate-monger Ilhan Omar in Congress.
https://www.thelocal.de/20161215/year-a ... ntegration
https://www.npr.org/series/102787287/th ... orist-axis

Why should I suddenly allow you to change the subject to legal migrants when the OP clearly referred to "Europe's escalating migrant crisis" and made the point that "European countries are being swamped by immigrants/refugees/economic wanderers/asylum seekers" and "just look at the problem on the US southern border"?

Because it is what I am discussing, not what the OP is discussing, 4th. You want a discussion with me, you have to play by rules that I agree with. Oh, and the last time I checked, "Asylum Seekers" are legal migrants...

Who said I wanted a discussion with you? You're the one who jumped in uninvited after I posted a comment, not the other way around.

If discussing legal migration is the game you want to play, feel free to play with yourself.

Now you're wandering off the trail. The subject isn't individuals being asked to change their customs; it's governments conforming to the customs of immigrant minorities.

Where is that being asked, 4th? Sure it isn't your imagination playing a roll here? An imagination fueled by Islamophobia?

Try reading the OP's original comment, as well as my follow-ups. Most of us have been talking all along about governments changing long-held customs to suit noisy immigrant minorities, with no input from the citizens whose opinions should matter most.

So it appears you're the one who's imagining ... that this is your thread.

As the story reads: "Earlier this week a Swedish labour court ruled that Semantix should pay her 40,000 krona (£3,420) in compensation ... The court heard that Alhajeh 'adheres to an interpretation of Islam that prohibits handshaking with the opposite sex unless it is a close member of the family.'”

Bingo ... a classic example of what the OP and I were talking about: A government court rules against the time-honored customs of a company (and nation) and in favor of the customs of an immigrant minority.

Again, a case of individuals asking that their customs be observed, nothing more.

Wrong again -- the Muslim woman wasn't ASKING that her customs be observed; she was suing to FORCE them to be observed. And the Swedish court kowtowed like any good politically correct government entity in the once-civilized West.

Nothing that actually suggests that there be an official government position undertaken on this.

NAHHHHH ... nothing except a ruling by a government court awarding 40,000 krona to the Muslim woman! Do you really think other Swedish businesses didn't take notice of it when considering their own corporate customs?

I'd suggest that the Muslim woman was perfectly correct to seek compensation after the job interview was ended because she refused to shake hands. Everybody is different, everybody has different customs. In my previous post I named two other nationalities that don't shake hands. Should they also be penalised? Should hand shaking become an official policy, 4th? Should be all people be forced to conform to your narrow minded viewpoint?

But ... but ... but you said, "Nations change their customs and their attitudes when they feel a need or a desire to. It is a choice of their citizens as individuals."

And now you say the Muslim woman "was perfectly correct to seek compensation."

Gee, Brian, which is it? Do the citizens get a choice in whether to change their customs, or do you prefer that immigrant minorities force their new country to implement whatever customs they bring with them?

I have merely suggested a correction as yes, she did use the wrong word. I suppose I could just start calling you a "septic," and you'd be happy with that? Afterall, it is an Australian custom and you wouldn't like to change Australian customs on an Australian website, now would you?

Heavens, I would be every bit as devastated as if my 4-year-old great-nephew called me a "poopy head."

American rules is played downunder, your saved!

You've done it again! It's "you're" in this case, not "your." (Remember, I'm merely "suggesting a correction," just as you did with Black Orchid!)

So what's your first language, by the way?

You will be able to shake hands though, except of course with the people from cultures which don't...

Just as long as I don't get fined in an Australian court for failing to adhere to some misogynistic 7th-century Islamic custom that you undoubtedly endorse in the name of diversity. Hopefully I wouldn't get hauled in for not slapping my wife whenever she leaves the house without a burqa!

We aren't discussing illegal immigrants, 4e. Well, I'm not. I'm not sure what you're talking about...

Right -- you're trying to hijack the thread from those of us who've been sticking to the original topic.

Sweden always leads the way, hey, 4e? How about say, Australia or Canada or Japan or China or India or Brazil or Argentina or New Zealand? Do they count more than lonely little Sweden?

Whoa ... how can a multicultural disciple like you mock Sweden when you're clearly thrilled that one of its courts awarded money to a Muslim woman who refused to shake hands?

Besides, I've already given you other examples, such as Merkel's brilliant decision to admit 1 million Muslims ... and the resulting New Year's Eve wave of sexual assaults on more than 1,000 girls and women in public places.

Admit it, you heard the news and were secretly jealous that you missed the gropefest! It's what uncovered infidel sluts deserve anyway, right?

Speaking of learning to read, where did you get the idea that migrants/asylum seekers were citizens?

Because they have no prefacing word to their classification, 4e. They are not Illegal Migrants or Illegal Asylum Seekers (indeed, you cannot have according to International Law an illegal Asylum Seeker). They are just ordinary, everyday, legal migrants or Asylum Seekers. You do understand the difference? Or has America abandoned the use of common English terms completely?

If international law declares all asylum seekers legal, then the technical term for it in my country is "toilet paper."

There's nothing "legal" about foreign nationals who sneak across the U.S. border. Sure, they can claim asylum, but that doesn't grant them the right to residency. Here, try spending 10 seconds reading up on the way U.S. law works:

"What Happens to Asylum Seekers Arriving at a U.S. Border?

"Noncitizens who are encountered by, or present themselves to, a U.S. official at a port of entry or near the border are subject to expedited removal."

I wasn't aware that Migrants or Asylum seekers were a financial burden on anyone, 4e. Would you care to explain to us how Migrants or Asylum Seekers are a financial burden on the US Economy? I was under the impression that Migrants or Asylum Seekers came to a new country to settle and and to work there, supporting themselves, like all other long-term residents or Citizens (you do understand the term "long-term residents"?).

That's a joke, right? No, considering who posted it, it probably isn't.

I wouldn't want you to break a fingernail trying to engage in any actual research or anything, so I'll throw you a bone:
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/refu ... e-medicaid

"On a yearly average, it is $1.8 billion, or $15,900 per refugee. Included in that are enormous refugee resettlement costs such as $867 million in welfare, housing assistance and education."

Other than that, migrants and asylum seekers are no burden whatsoever.

Of course you realise that el Presidente Trump's efforts are all short-term, rather than longer term growth, don't you, 4e?

Oh, sure -- that shiny Nobel Prize in Economics that sits on your desk attests to your expertise in U.S. economic matters.

Numbers? Oh, it all boils down to numbers does it, 4th? How many are allowed in now? How many want to enter the US? Answer those questions and I will provide an answer to yours.

"How many want to enter the U.S.?"
Millions, maybe billions.

Ah, so generalisations are allowed, are they, 4e?

Ask an unspecific question, get an unspecific answer. If you want an exact count, try going house to house around the world and tallying up the yes answers. I'll wait.