It is 1933...

[cods]

Stephen Fry? He's got a face like a run over jam tin. Plus he is about as funny as a crutch!

I do wonder whether he is the male or female in his partnership/marriage to whatshisname.

Oh, and he is a Leftard and hates Trump.

http://www.stephenfry.com/2016/03/trump ... rsoverall/

most "celebs" are nef....

they tend to live high off the hog..and rush to be greeted by the peasants.rub shoulders with the hoi polloi

all the while feigning they give a shit about the poor...lololol


wins votes..huhummmm friends.

[brian ross]

most "celebs" are nef....

they tend to live high off the hog..and rush to be greeted by the peasants.rub shoulders with the hoi polloi

all the while feigning they give a shit about the poor...lololol


wins votes..huhummmm friends.

Sounds just like the Tories, Cods...

[Nicole]

@ Brian

More or less, "Nicole". I used the novel to illustrate the idea that Hitler was just a man. The Nazis were a movement. A movement created by the turmoil at the end of WWI and in the Weimar Republic's inability to apparently manage the economy of Germany. There was the danger that someone worse than Hitler might have arisen, if Hitler hadn't. What always amazed me about the Nazis was just how inefficient they actually were. Their society was closer to a medieval feudal one than a modern one.

Just so I'm absolutely clear, are you saying there were various setting conditions in Germany Post WW1 that created the Nazi movement, and that if Hitler hadn't ridden that wave someone else would have? Please confirm.

Basically, yes, "Nicole". Germany was a ferment of differing political movements, Communism, Nationalist, Fascist, you name it. If the Weimer had been firmer, it might have resisted the rise of Fascism but personally, I doubt.

So Brian I’m very curious. Do you see any of these types of setting conditions - as you have agreed created the Nazi movement in Germany in the 1930s - in any westernised countries in 2019?

Not really, "Nicole". Despite all the brouhaha that certain people might create about Muslims or Immigrants in general or left-wingers or any other group, most western countries are actually fairly settled. None are suffering galloping inflation, massive unemployment, street fights on a daily basis, etc. You have protest movements in various Western European countries and the US and to a lesser extent in Australia but they are hardly representative of the majority of the populations of those countries. Yes, there are problems but they are relatively minor. War in most Western countries are a forgotten thing. The last war in Western Europe was two-three generations ago. The US hasn't been directly embroiled in a war since the Civil War (or "war of Northern Aggression" as some seem to like to call it) over ~150 years ago. Australia hasn't been directly attacked since WWII, two-three generations ago. The environment today is in no way similar to Wiemar Germany. The extreme-rightwingers are not anywhere as popular as the Nazis were then. Hansonism is bubbling along at about 15% at it's top level. Fraser Anning represents 19 people, who's votes he didn't even win.

Do you perceive "these types of setting conditions," anywhere, "Nicole"? You like to ask me questions but then, I haven't really asked any, yet.

Yeah I do actually Brian. According to the census of June, 1933, the percentage of Jews in Germany was just 0.75%. In 2015 it was estimated that the population of Muslims in Germany was 5.7%, and that 9.1% of all infants in Germany had Muslim parents. I am not going To go through all the percentages in Europe, but compared to the number of Jews living in Germany in 1933, they are very high, and given Muslim birth rates, just set to climb.

This may not be a huge problem whilst resources are plentiful. But the world needs to triple its food production by 2050, to meet demand. It’ll be back to two tribes battling for the same waterhole, so to speak. And hitler will rise again.

[Nicole]

Bump for Brian

[brian ross]

@ Brian



Just so I'm absolutely clear, are you saying there were various setting conditions in Germany Post WW1 that created the Nazi movement, and that if Hitler hadn't ridden that wave someone else would have? Please confirm.

Basically, yes, "Nicole". Germany was a ferment of differing political movements, Communism, Nationalist, Fascist, you name it. If the Weimer had been firmer, it might have resisted the rise of Fascism but personally, I doubt.

So Brian I’m very curious. Do you see any of these types of setting conditions - as you have agreed created the Nazi movement in Germany in the 1930s - in any westernised countries in 2019?

Not really, "Nicole". Despite all the brouhaha that certain people might create about Muslims or Immigrants in general or left-wingers or any other group, most western countries are actually fairly settled. None are suffering galloping inflation, massive unemployment, street fights on a daily basis, etc. You have protest movements in various Western European countries and the US and to a lesser extent in Australia but they are hardly representative of the majority of the populations of those countries. Yes, there are problems but they are relatively minor. War in most Western countries are a forgotten thing. The last war in Western Europe was two-three generations ago. The US hasn't been directly embroiled in a war since the Civil War (or "war of Northern Aggression" as some seem to like to call it) over ~150 years ago. Australia hasn't been directly attacked since WWII, two-three generations ago. The environment today is in no way similar to Wiemar Germany. The extreme-rightwingers are not anywhere as popular as the Nazis were then. Hansonism is bubbling along at about 15% at it's top level. Fraser Anning represents 19 people, who's votes he didn't even win.

Do you perceive "these types of setting conditions," anywhere, "Nicole"? You like to ask me questions but then, I haven't really asked any, yet.

Yeah I do actually Brian. According to the census of June, 1933, the percentage of Jews in Germany was just 0.75%. In 2015 it was estimated that the population of Muslims in Germany was 5.7%, and that 9.1% of all infants in Germany had Muslim parents. I am not going To go through all the percentages in Europe, but compared to the number of Jews living in Germany in 1933, they are very high, and given Muslim birth rates, just set to climb.

Sorry, I missed this, "Nicole". An interesting analysis. However, again as I've pointed out, the economic circumstances and social circumstances are completely different. You paint Muslims as being the villains here - exactly as the Nazis painted the Jews. Tell me, do you believe the Jews were the villains in Germany? You sure your Islamophobia - oops, I've used a naughty word but it describes your attitudes politely - isn't playing a part here? Most of Europe is quite happy living with a minority of Muslims in their population - it is only a minority of right-wing Islamophobic people who get upset.

As for Muslim "birth rates" most professional demographers laugh at the bullshit that the Islamophobes saturate the web with. Muslims, like immigrants quickly reduce their birthrates to comparable to the dominant cultural group because the same economic imperatives govern Muslim lives as they do other peoples. Muslims are just as aspirational, they want the new car, the new house, the new TV, the new computer, the better schools, etc. So, women have less time to spend on child rearing, and are required to work just as hard as the men. Within one or two generations, Muslim birth rates are reduced to similar levels to that of the dominant cultural/religious groups.

You claims are similar to what was said about Catholics you realise? According to the Protestants, we should be swimming in Catholic kids by now. Funny that. Seems Monty Python had the right idea about "Every Sperm being precious." Catholics use contraceptions just as much as Protestants...

This may not be a huge problem whilst resources are plentiful. But the world needs to triple its food production by 2050, to meet demand. It’ll be back to two tribes battling for the same waterhole, so to speak. And hitler will rise again.

The world will cope, "Nicole". The Green Revolution - the original green revolution - in the late 1960s saw India about to feed itself. Resources can and will cope. The real problem is Climate Change. We will see crop failures not because of a lack of resources but because it's too hot/too dry/too wet/too cold. Our population is approximately right for the future IMO, not because of concerns about culture or religion but because of climate.

[Nicole]

Thanks for a well thought through, civil reply Brian.

Sorry, I missed this, "Nicole". An interesting analysis. However, again as I've pointed out, the economic circumstances and social circumstances are completely different. You paint Muslims as being the villains here - exactly as the Nazis painted the Jews. Tell me, do you believe the Jews were the villains in Germany? You sure your Islamophobia - oops, I've used a naughty word but it describes your attitudes politely - isn't playing a part here? Most of Europe is quite happy living with a minority of Muslims in their population - it is only a minority of right-wing Islamophobic people who get upset.

Really? Can you link me to this?

As for Muslim "birth rates" most professional demographers laugh at the bullshit that the Islamophobes saturate the web with. Muslims, like immigrants quickly reduce their birthrates to comparable to the dominant cultural group because the same economic imperatives govern Muslim lives as they do other peoples. Muslims are just as aspirational, they want the new car, the new house, the new TV, the new computer, the better schools, etc. So, women have less time to spend on child rearing, and are required to work just as hard as the men. Within one or two generations, Muslim birth rates are reduced to similar levels to that of the dominant cultural/religious groups.

You claims are similar to what was said about Catholics you realise? According to the Protestants, we should be swimming in Catholic kids by now. Funny that. Seems Monty Python had the right idea about "Every Sperm being precious." Catholics use contraceptions just as much as Protestants...

Catholics and Muslims are chalk and cheese, Brian. The geo-political reality of where they come from - Catholics in Europe and Mulsims primarily Middle East - are different. Again, can you link me to Muslim's quickly reducing their birth rates?

The world will cope, "Nicole". The Green Revolution - the original green revolution - in the late 1960s saw India about to feed itself. Resources can and will cope. The real problem is Climate Change. We will see crop failures not because of a lack of resources but because it's too hot/too dry/too wet/too cold. Our population is approximately right for the future IMO, not because of concerns about culture or religion but because of climate.

I disagree. I am going to start another thread which incorporates population.

[brian ross]

Thanks for a well thought through, civil reply Brian.

Sorry, I missed this, "Nicole". An interesting analysis. However, again as I've pointed out, the economic circumstances and social circumstances are completely different. You paint Muslims as being the villains here - exactly as the Nazis painted the Jews. Tell me, do you believe the Jews were the villains in Germany? You sure your Islamophobia - oops, I've used a naughty word but it describes your attitudes politely - isn't playing a part here? Most of Europe is quite happy living with a minority of Muslims in their population - it is only a minority of right-wing Islamophobic people who get upset.

Really? Can you link me to this?

Only anecdotally, "Nicole". I have many friends, many of whom are right-wingers who wouldn't lie about how their societies' cope with Muslims. They are happy with most Muslims who they perceive as being peaceful, well-adjusted, assimilated people. They recognise there are troublemakers on both sides of the fence. Do you?

As for Muslim "birth rates" most professional demographers laugh at the bullshit that the Islamophobes saturate the web with. Muslims, like immigrants quickly reduce their birthrates to comparable to the dominant cultural group because the same economic imperatives govern Muslim lives as they do other peoples. Muslims are just as aspirational, they want the new car, the new house, the new TV, the new computer, the better schools, etc. So, women have less time to spend on child rearing, and are required to work just as hard as the men. Within one or two generations, Muslim birth rates are reduced to similar levels to that of the dominant cultural/religious groups.

You claims are similar to what was said about Catholics you realise? According to the Protestants, we should be swimming in Catholic kids by now. Funny that. Seems Monty Python had the right idea about "Every Sperm being precious." Catholics use contraceptions just as much as Protestants...

Catholics and Muslims are chalk and cheese, Brian. The geo-political reality of where they come from - Catholics in Europe and Mulsims primarily Middle East - are different. Again, can you link me to Muslim's quickly reducing their birth rates?

Catholics - primarily from Southern Europe, once had large families as well, "Nicole". Downunder, when they first arrived they continued that trend but quickly within one or two generations reduced their family sizes as the mothers became a fellow bread-winner and social security replaced the need for children to care for their parents.

As for Muslim fertility rates:

3.7 Muslim fertility

In 2006 Muslim women aged 40 to 44 years had 2.9 babies each, compared with 2.0 for all women in Australia.
After adjusting for factors including education and employment, the average number of children born to Australian Muslim women was 2.5, which was still higher than Christian women, who had the second highest average fertility level at 2.1. Fertility behaviour is one of the most socially and culturally regulated behaviours in society. There is a general tendency towards convergence of fertility behaviours of migrant and local populations

[Source]

FactCheck Q&A: the facts on birth rates for Muslim couples and non-Muslim couples in Australia

Those are two articles on Muslim fertility rates in Australia, "Nicole". I found them with a two minute google search. You might like to try doing that yourself...

The world will cope, "Nicole". The Green Revolution - the original green revolution - in the late 1960s saw India about to feed itself. Resources can and will cope. The real problem is Climate Change. We will see crop failures not because of a lack of resources but because it's too hot/too dry/too wet/too cold. Our population is approximately right for the future IMO, not because of concerns about culture or religion but because of climate.

I disagree. I am going to start another thread which incorporates population.

Fine, go for it.

[Black Orchid]

In 2006 Muslim women aged 40 to 44 years had 2.9 babies each, compared with 2.0 for all women in Australia.

What about those aged 13 to 40, who would be the most 'productive'.

[brian ross]

In 2006 Muslim women aged 40 to 44 years had 2.9 babies each, compared with 2.0 for all women in Australia.

What about those aged 13 to 40, who would be the most 'productive'.

Babies at that young an age is unusual, even amongst Muslims. You are showing your Islamophobia again, you realise?

[Black Orchid]

In 2006 Muslim women aged 40 to 44 years had 2.9 babies each, compared with 2.0 for all women in Australia.

What about those aged 13 to 40, who would be the most 'productive'.

Babies at that young an age is unusual, even amongst Muslims. You are showing your Islamophobia again, you realise?

And Brian you are showing your ignorance. Stating 'statistics' for women approaching menopause (or who have possibly already reached menopause) and trying to pass them off as of normal child bearing age is ridiculous.