Greek myths

[Super Nova]

I don't follow the logic of just pumping more and more good money into the Greek ecconomy.

They are just going to crash and burn, it's juyst a matter os when. The greek unions are in strike for 2 days from today in protect. Good for the ecconomy.

The only thing I can figure is that it is all fear driven. If Greece exists the Eruo, then the dominos start to fall.

They need to move to a full feferation like the US or just stop this nonsense, bring the world into recession/depression and get it over with.

[Mattus]

Meet Greece. Greece was poor and few people wanted to buy things from Greece. For that reason, few people had any need to buy Drachmas, the currency of Greece that you needed only if you wanted to buy Greek things, so the value of the Drachma was very low. When the value of the Drachma got low enough, some people decided to hire some Greek people to do menial work since you only had to pay them in Drachmas, which were really really cheap, people would holiday a bit in Greece, because the exchange rate was so good. One Chinese Yuan would buy you many sambuccas. So it kind of evened out and the Drachma never got too low and the Greeks were poor but not desparately poor and most of them had a job.

Now meet Germany. Everyone wanted to buy things from Germany. For that reason the mighty Deutschmark was highly sought after as everyone tried to exchange their own currency for the currency of Germany, which you need to do in order to buy German things. However, when the Deutschmark got too high, those German things became too expensive for many people and they bought a bit less. So it kind of evened out and the Deutchmark never got too high and the Germans were rich but not fuck off rich.

Then one day, Germany came to Greece and said "Hey little buddy, no one likes you. But I like you. How would you like to be my friend? See how big and strong my Deutschmark is? You can have a big Deutschmark like me too, one day."

So Greece and Germany decided to have a shared currency, the Euro. Everyone still wanted to buy German things, so lots of people were exchanging their currency for Euros, which is what you needed to buy German things. The value of the Euro was high. Few people wanted to buy Greek things, just as before, but now more than ever, because to buy Greek things you needed expensive Euros too. Why would they have Greek things when German things now cost the same?

So even the few people who used to buy Greek things because they were cheap, started buying German things instead. Hell, even the Greeks would buy German things. Germany became extremely rich, with lots of people buying lots of things and paying for them in expensive Euros.

No one wanted to employ Greek people because they had to pay them in Euros, which are expensive, rather than Drachmas, which are cheap. German people cost the same. Even the Greek government began to realise that handing out welfare cheques in Euros was costing a lot more than it used to when they were in Drachmas. Because no one wanted to employ Greek people when German people cost the same, the Greek government had to hand out a lot more expensive Euro welfare cheques. They had to borrow a lot of money, and soon enough people stopped lending it to them.

So Greece turned to Germany and said "Hey this fucking sucks, I don't want to be your Euro buddy any more, I prefer having my little Drachma instead." and Germany's reply was "FUCK OFF, I'M RICH."

In a few years, the Greeks will stop rioting in their streets and start building tanks. You heard it here first.

[mantra]

It's would not be a surprise if Greece decided they weren't going to be pushed around anymore. This is what happens when we consume more than we produce in our own country. Regardless of how we hear constantly how well placed we are economically - we have an alarming rate of foreign debt as we purchase more goods from overseas than we export. The mining "boom" is keeping us afloat - but it can't go on for much longer especially as so many of the mining companies are foreign owned now and the collateral damage has become alarming.

[Outlaw Yogi]

In a few years, the Greeks will stop rioting in their streets and start building tanks.

Them, and numerous others.

You heard it here first.

Some maybe, but I've been predicting exactly such a scenario since .. um .. I forget .. but years prior to 08, the GFC just confirmed my theory/belief/suspicion/expectation.

[Jovial Monk]

I have been predicting civil war in the PIIGS for a while now. If northern Europe gets really tough it will be like Libya or Syria, if not it will be more like Tunisia. Either way a lot of French banks will fall over and a Great Depression starts.

[Jovial Monk]

Have a read:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012 ... ro-strikes

We cannot allow Greece to go bankrupt. Our priority is to do whatever it takes to approve the new economic programme and proceed with the new loan agreement.

It goes without saying that whoever disagrees and does not vote for the new programme cannot remain in the government.

That is the Greek PM appointed not elected by the people! He is not PM so much as a a debt collector on behalf of Germany and France.

The “whatever it takes” is reducing the Greek people to beggary!

“He said there would be a sale of state assets worth at least €19bn up to 2015”

Watch for corruption and stupid privatisations (think Libs and Telstra, think Russia) followed by price hikes!

Meanwhile European markets have closed and it's not a pretty sight. Germany's Dax is down 1.41%, France's Cac is 1.51% lower and Italy is off 1.76%. The FTSE 100 finished 43.08 points lower at 5852.39, a 0.73% decline.

Athens fell more than 5% before recovering some of its losses to end 3% lower.

Meanwhile on Wall Street the Dow Jones Industrial Average is down 120 points at the moment, or nearly 1%.

Sounding a bit like 1929 you think?

[AiA in Atlanta]

Obama's rivals can't attack him over the economy b/c it is looking better but if Greece negatively impacts the US it could be curtains for the president.

[Jovial Monk]

A Repug Administration in the US would just put the finishing touches on a new Long Depression!

[mantra]

It's so obvious the Greece is being auctioned off. They couldn't adapt to the Euro initially and it's just got worse as time goes on. Now with the proposed austerity deal - the people are wondering if they can tighten their belts any more. So many citizens who were once coping - have become homeless and hungry in the past year and it's going to get worse as more jobs go and the award wage is cut by 20%.

There will be many nations who will own a part of Greece now that it's for sale. It's no surprise there are riots. They're trying to fight back although it's becoming more violent each day. It's not going to get them anywhere. Which government today listens or cares about the people? The IMF controls all of us.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/busines ... 6269280730

[Jovial Monk]

Greek MPs pass austerity plan amid violent protests

Historic buildings in central Athens have been set ablaze

Greece's parliament has passed a controversial package of austerity measures, demanded by the eurozone and IMF in return for a 130bn-euro ($170bn; £110bn) bailout to avoid default.

Coalition parties expelled over 40 deputies for failing to back the bill.

The vote came amid some of the worst violence seen in Greece in years.

Protesters outside parliament threw stones and petrol bombs, and police fired tear gas. Several people were injured and buildings were set on fire.

PM Lucas Papademos urged calm, saying violence had no place in a democracy.

Lawmakers have also approved a related deal to write off 100bn euros of Greek debt held by private banks.

Despite a rebellion by some MPs from parties in the ruling coalition, the result was expected, reports the BBC's Mark Lowen in Athens.

Pasok, the largest party, and its coalition ally New Democracy - which have both backed the bill - account for more than 230 deputies out of a total of 300.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-17007761

Violence has no place in a democracy, mouths Greece’s unelected PM, while inflicting violence on his people to please his foreign masters. Germany has calculated what they are doing to Greece is a deterrent to other members of the PIIGS to break away from the EZ. Calculations can go wrong—there could well be civil war in Greece which could spread to other EZ states, eventually resulting in some N-S war.

Hmmmm

“How will the Euro crisis end?”

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-16098582

Explore 4 different results.

This is from “Depression:”

The recession makes it very hard for governments to actually cut their borrowing, because they are spending more on unemployment benefits and earning less in income tax. Companies and mortgage borrowers find it harder to pay their debts, putting the banks in trouble, who cut back their lending even more, undermining the economy further. Eventually borrowers, including governments, have to write off their debts, and many banks and businesses go bust.

If this sounds familiar it is because we have been saying that in this thread (http://www.polanimal.com.au/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=1100) for a while.

Depression in Europe will mean Depression in the US and Asia, meaning us!

My fear is that before Depression we may see civil war widening into Europe’s own North - South civil war, war involving nuclear armed states.