Sci - Goldilocks planet is no fairytale

[annielaurie]

Amazing, Nova! Right on the nose! Exactly!

Especially these:

The universe is not random however at the smallest level somethings appear random to us as outside observers.

The facinating thing is that the universe is (a) structure to allow the evolution of a complex self replicating set of matter that can ask questions and has the capactity to understand the universe it lives in. That is amasing. So amazing that we created a god to explain the unexplainable in our early development. Today we need no such explaination. I do believe there is a compelling inbuilt need in most humans to have a believe in something.

God could be natural

Could it be that God is actually the universe itself? God is the structure itself? Could it be that God was the singularity that expanded and stretched out, and evolved from the simple forces and particles and inflated to become the astonishing complexity that we see today: what we ourselves are a part of today on this particular planet as lifeforms made of the reproducing regenerating heavy elements distilled from supernovae of first generation stars: which made second generation stars with solar systems like ours: we ourselves who are made of physical matter but with the mental awareness of the beginning which was God?

Built in, I think it was built in at the beginning (of this particular bubble of a universe). And I think we had (at some point) evolved a "religion gene," which keeps getting passed on: hence our need to believe in God. Right on the nose ..

[Super Nova]

I think this is another one.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Article/201112116134475

Astronomers have discovered the first Earth-like planets orbiting a star similar to our own Sun.

[Super Nova]

Built in, I think it was built in at the beginning (of this particular bubble of a universe). And I think we had (at some point) evolved a "religion gene," which keeps getting passed on: hence our need to believe in God. Right on the nose ..

This is my belief. I think it has been a survival advantage.

Image a the advantage of the first tribes that pulled together under a common religious believe and the advantage they had to grow their culture over these human typoes that did not have a common purpiose for workingtogether, working to common rules (laid down by god) and the political power of those the gods communicated through.

Non-believers were eliminated.

[AiA in Atlanta]

God is that energy and intelligence that brought forth this physical universe from nothing to something. So, yes, God is the universe itself. There is no God "out there." God not only evolves through the physical but through our consciousness as well. Why can't the universe have an interior as well as an exterior?

Researchers concluded long ago that the universe having emerged by chance is as likely as a troupe of monkeys striking a keyboard until producing a play by Shakespere.

[annielaurie]

God is that energy and intelligence that brought forth this physical universe from nothing to something. So, yes, God is the universe itself. There is no God "out there." God not only evolves through the physical but through our consciousness as well. Why can't the universe have an interior as well as an exterior?

Researchers concluded long ago that the universe having emerged by chance is as likely as a troupe of monkeys striking a keyboard until producing a play by Shakespere.

Okay Atlanta, when you put it this way, I can accept what you are saying. Very similar to the way I see it.

This is why I practice Anglicanism (Episcopalianism in the USA) and am a liturgical communion minister there - because even though I don't believe the Bible literally but see it as an anthology of ancient stories and poetry and metaphor - our theologians call it "sacred story" - I too have the need to believe in God and be a part of the fabric everywhere that is the almighty God.

I am certainly not an atheist, but I accept modern science and cosmology and particle physics and evolution of life on earth - and perhaps on many other worlds as well.

[Super Nova]

I am certainly not an atheist, but I accept modern science and cosmology and particle physics and evolution of life on earth - and perhaps on many other worlds as well.

I have to say I am an atheist. I have no belief in god, certainly not one that gives a shit about our daily sins or our lives.

The universe could have been created by chance if when universes are created and the parameters are not right then their existence is short (big crunch) or they expand into lifeless, matterless energy only universes. If this process of creations is infinite then the probability of an univrse that gets the parameters right for a self awarenesss to evolve become probable.

If we have the view there is only one universe in all of everything that is (which is to assume there is other wheres outside the universe, the multiverse model) then it become difficult to understand why ours is so perfect. This single universe view equates to the ignorance that the Earth is flat and is the centre of the cosmos. This is where the many monkeys argument is strong but flawed. It assumes there can only be one. The trouble is, we may never know because we are bound to this one and only this one.

Time to get out there and meet some more advanced lifeforms. However, like Boxy, I'm concerned they will dominate us rather than share knowledge with us.

[AiA in Atlanta]

The story of the Universe is far more inspiring than the Bible: we were all present when the Universe exploded from nothingness. We were all star dust once.

[Super Nova]

The story of the Universe is far more inspiring than the Bible: we were all present when the Universe exploded from nothingness. We were all star dust once.

Yes.

The total energy in the universe is exactly the same today as at the beginning of time. (excluding any unknown leakage that occurs due to our current lack of understanding, e.g. Blackholes leaking energy out into another place outside our universe... for example).

Energy and matter and other unknown forms of matter (dark matter) are intertwined.

The universe was solely Helium and Hydrogen.

Suns formed, they will produce all matter up to Iron.

When suns go supernova they then produce traces of elements heavier than iron and explode all the matter into space.

We are made of these elements.

These elements formed into gas clouds and gravity allowed them to colapse to form new suns and planets.

A planet in the goldilocks zone had a chance but probable event that formed the first self replicating organic molicules (or collected them from space). (RNA). These molicules banded togther with others to form aself replicating molecule that was the blue print to build a complex organism. This organism evolved and branched into the life we see today.

A branch in this evolution produce an organism that asked questions like, why amd I here, what is the purpose to life, what is the universe, there must be a god.

The bible left out some bits.

[AiA in Atlanta]

Annie, you and SN seem resistant to the idea that the universe has an interior otherwise known as consciousness. Why is that?

On another note, anyone familiar with the work of Brian Swimme?

“Each being in the universe yearns for the free energy necessary for survival and development. Each existence resists extinction. The consequent history of violence in the universe is as inevitable as the gravitational pull between the Earth and the Sun.”

― Brian Swimme, The Universe Story : From the Primordial Flaring Forth to the Ecozoic Era--A Celebration of the Unfolding of the Cosmos


“The earth was once molten rock and now sings operas.”



― Brian Swimme

[Super Nova]

Annie, you and SN seem resistant to the idea that the universe has an interior otherwise known as consciousness. Why is that?

I can not speak for Annie.

The universe is not conscious. Once the universe came into being, it had or settled down to a set of balances, symmetries and ratios that formed the relationships between forces, energy and matter (all forms including dark and anti). Once this was defined the universe progressed. There is no need for any underlying consciousness to get from the start to where we are now.
The amasing thing was the creation and evolution of life as we know it from these rules and circumstances when right permitted it to be established. A simple idea. The first forms of life just looked like any old complex chemical set of reactions. Once these reactions happened on a way to covert energy to replicate we had the beginning of the elements of life. It is just like crystal growth, there is an ordered pattern when things are just right. Each looks the same as the next.
RNA combined to form DNA that formed to control the binding of other elements to produce a more complex form of life. Eventually a thread of this evolution become conscious, conscious of self. Then we began to ask questions? I see my dog think of questions, he just cannot communicate them to me. Humans began to communicate complex questions… looking for answers w communicated complex concepts to explain the unexplainable.

Jyust because we feel we are conscious and that the universe appears to have purpose does not mean it does. It’s purpose is not conscious, it is a set of rules that interact like a mathematical algorithm. We would need a computer the size of the universe to just calculate events if we could run it faster. I’m sure the answer would be 42 and a Slartibartfast would be involved.
A set of events set on a course running to a set of rules is not consciousness.