ETS and retarded views

[IQSRLOW]

And which of those have fully implemented an ETS?

[freediver]

The Annex 1 countries have by default, in the sense that if they don't meet targets, they either have to buy permits or face even tougher economic penalties. International trade in emissions permits has already begaun. It seems that within each country, they can use any method they want. Australia is already part of this as we have ratified, so if we don't meet our targets we will face economic penalties. The ETS Rudd is talking about is internal.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyoto_Protocol

It was adopted on 11 December 1997 by the 3rd Conference of the Parties, which was meeting in Kyoto, and it entered into force on 16 February 2005. As of May 2008, 182 parties have ratified the protocol.[1] Of these, 36 developed cg countries (plus the EU as a party in its own right) are required to reduce greenhouse gas emissions to the levels specified for each of them in the treaty (representing over 61.6% of emissions from Annex I countries),[1][2] with three more countries intending to participate.[

Any Annex I country that fails to meet its Kyoto obligation will be penalized by having to submit 1.3 emission allowances in a second commitment period for every ton of greenhouse gas emissions they exceed their cap in the first commitment period (i.e., 2008-2012).
As of January 2008, and running through 2012, Annex I countries have to reduce their greenhouse gas emissions by a collective average of 5% below their 1990 levels (for many countries, such as the EU member states, this corresponds to some 15% below their expected greenhouse gas emissions in 2008). While the average emissions reduction is 5%, national limitations range from an 8% average reduction across the European Union to a 10% emissions increase for Iceland; but, since the EU's member states each have individual obligations,[5] much larger increases (up to 27%) are allowed for some of the less developed EU countries (see below #Increase in greenhouse gas emission since 1990). [2] Reduction limitations expire in 2013.
Kyoto includes "flexible mechanisms" which allow Annex I economies to meet their greenhouse gas emission limitation by purchasing GHG emission reductions from elsewhere. These can be bought either from financial exchanges, from projects which reduce emissions in non-Annex I economies under the Clean Development Mechanism (CDM), from other Annex 1 countries under the JI, or from Annex I countries with excess allowances. Only CDM Executive Board-accredited Certified Emission Reductions (CER) can be bought and sold in this manner. Under the aegis of the UN, Kyoto established this Bonn-based Clean Development Mechanism Executive Board to assess and approve projects ("CDM Projects") in Non-Annex I economies prior to awarding CERs. (A similar scheme called "Joint Implementation" or "JI" applies in transitional economies mainly covering the former Soviet Union and Eastern Europe).

[IQSRLOW]

The Annex 1 countries have by default, in the sense that if they don't meet targets, they either have to buy permits or face even tougher economic penalties.

So none of them have introduced an internal ETS?

[freediver]

I've got no idea. I think Germany was using taxes, but I heard they exempted coal, which is a bit silly. You could always trying finding out for yourself.

If they didn't use an ETS or a tax, their economies will suffer more than necessary. Though none of them have had an 'economic catastrophe' over it.

[IQSRLOW]

If they didn't use an ETS or a tax, their economies will suffer more than necessary. Though none of them have had an 'economic catastrophe' over it.

Probably because they didn't introduce an ETS...or maybe they rejected the advice of the economists as meaningless drivel

[freediver]

Do you think we should reject the advice of economists as meaningless drivel?

[IQSRLOW]

I already do- perhaps the rest of the world has come to terms with the fact a consensus from economists is virtually useless

[freediver]

Do you know better than the economists?

[IQSRLOW]

Let's just say I don't know worse

[freediver]

Do you reject economic theory?