Peak Oil ..again

[harvey]

Presently the the CO2 tax is applicable to all cans of soft drink, to be known as cans of pollution; Coca Cola - pollution, Fanta - pollution, Sprite - pollution, Pepsi - pollution, even beer cans are cans of pollution! As Gillard claimed that the tax was to address carbon pollution when it is actually addressing carbon dioxide.
So can see the ALP & Greens getting behind the concept of liquid coal. Then they would be able to claim that there are such cans of pollution and that they do exist!!

[Jovial Monk]

You are a real, totally brainless idiot, eh “harvey”? You will fit in well with others such like Lisa, Yogi Bear and IQ.

[IQS.RLOW]

Not as brainless as you are with your fanciful suggestion that the NBN with have everyone working from home (it won't) and to suggest it will save GHG emissions (it won't)

Just like every other fanciful idea you are labor get behind, it will fail because both you and they are losers and fuckups

[harvey]

Not as brainless as you are with your fanciful suggestion that the NBN with have everyone working from home (it won't) and to suggest it will save GHG emissions (it won't)

Just like every other fanciful idea you are labor get behind, it will fail because both you and they are losers and fuckups

Itd be funny if it weren't true.


But nevertheless he also isn't familiar with satire either.

[Outlaw Yogi]

How is the hydrogen going to be produced? IOW, what energy source will be used to make it?

Didn't say, but then this is about the storage issue. Hydrogen atoms being the smallest in existence means cylinders used for storing hydrocarbon gases are no good - hydrogen litterally leaks through the steel. I used to suggest sealing such cylinders with latex or silicone rubber for (backyarders) or switching to cylinders made from biomymicry created porcelain, industrial nylon or polypropelene, but the yanks are using kevlar cylinders.

As to a power source for splitting water molecules (to hydrogen and oxygen) which requires a minimum of 1.7 volts to achieve, with a return of 1.23 volts, so less than 1/2 volt consumption, it would be pointless doing unless the electrical current came from anything but renewables (solar PV, solar thermal, geo-thermal, wind turbines).
Iceland uses geo-thermal turbines to extract the hydrogen from water, which runs their fishing fleet.

Note: Thermal cracking of crude oil requires heating to a minimum of 600 degree C, but 900 degree C is typical, so requires vastly more energy to achieve than splitting water molecules. Although petro-chemical companies create fanciful scenarios claiming hydrogen from water splitting consumes more energy than extracting petroleum and dieseline from crude oil.

Much better ways of reducing oil consumption/GHG emissions are things like the NBN that will gradually see virtual travel replace real travel at least for commuting and business.

The NBN won't be able to beam me up a box of bananas. But a hydrogen fueled internal combustion engined truck could move them just like a diesel fueled internal combustion engined truck.

[Jovial Monk]

Hmmm did I say it would eliminate all commuting? Guess IQ can’t read. Didn’t mention freight. Guess Yogi Bear can’t read either.

The only renewable power source of any merit in Oz is tidal. A solar thermal installation requires like 20Km by 20Km installation, the geothermal won’t work because the rock above the hot rocks is fractured so steam is lost—just possible the hot rocks under the Cooper Basin are suitable. Wind is expensive but good in some locations: Backstairs Passage between Kangaroo Island and the mainland is pretty much always windy but nary a windmill did I see there either on the island or the hills behind Middleton-Pt Elliott and the Greens would campaign against them—they would no doubt spoil the view!

Would like to see the economics of PV on house roofs without expensive subsidies but with a carbon price applying—and with the power going into the home not the grid. Present PV systems have a problem, the actual PV cells are in the sun and get hot lowering their efficiency. Alternatives have been developed with organic coatings on glass that direct the photons to the edges of the glass where the PV cells are—less cells needed, they are not in direct sun so if this research makes it into the real world I reckon PV would be a damn sight more useful.

I have friends living outside of Bathurst, on 300Ha with both solar cells and a windmill and woodburning stove/HWS—still not enough with just the two of them, ended up buying a propane fridge. A family with young kids—forget it.

[Outlaw Yogi]

Hmmm did I say it would eliminate all commuting? Guess IQ can’t read. Didn’t mention freight. Guess Yogi Bear can’t read either.

You're deliberately missing the point, transfering information, which has been electronic for quite a while now, does not compare with transporting bulky items .. so there's no point getting bitchy about an off tangent suggestion being stomped .. stay on target and your arguments (may or may not ) have more weight.

The only renewable power source of any merit in Oz is tidal.

What an absurd thing to claim.
We've got, or have potential for, just about every renewable going.
I'm not really impressed with wave/tidal mechanisms yet. I'm sure they'll have their niches and prototypes will improve, but generally the more parts used to transfer kinetic energy the less efficient the process.

A solar thermal installation requires like 20Km by 20Km installation,

No, you've got it arse about, solar thermal is concentrated, solar PV requires space.

[Jovial Monk]

If you don’t want nuke and want to rely on ST you need one 20x20Km ST installation for the kind of megawatts that powers a city like Adelaide, say.

I mentioned commuting, not freight.

If SPV could be more efficient, and battery technology improves all-electric cars could become attractive—cells on the car surfaces, using the windows as described plus solar cells on garage or carport roof and the odd top-up charge from the mains, nearly free fuel.

The NBN will make the biggest single difference in the next 20 years I think.

Still would like to see a nice big nuke power station say at Pt Augusta, supplying electricity to most of SA with enough to sell to Vic/NSW. I dare say one will be built, but it will take 5 years before a govt will dare make noises about it.

[IQS.RLOW]

The NBN will make the biggest single difference in the next 20 years I think.

There's your problem...

But kudos for tying 2 stupid wasteful and idiotic labor ideas together to produce a stupid idiotic outcome

[harvey]

The NBN will make the biggest single difference in the next 20 years I think.

There's your problem...

But kudos for tying 2 stupid wasteful and idiotic labor ideas together to produce a stupid idiotic outcome

True, the NBN will be the biggest white elephant that Australia has deliberately purchased.
Have the ALP revealed the business plan yet?