Has Labor lost its way ?

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Juliar
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Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by Juliar » Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:35 pm

Is the rusty wreckage of the ALP doomed to remain in OPPOSITION for the next 20 years ? Can Albo the Schoolboy steal ScoMo's winning recipe ?

Is the ultimate "solution" to combine the rotting relics of the ALP and the Greenies into a new Party called the GARBO PARTY ?




Election review: There is no light on the hill for Labor
By Martin Hirst | 9 November 2019, 7:00am

Image
Former Trade Minister Craig Emerson and former South Australian Premier Jay Weatherill have spent months investigating the ALP Election defeat (Screenshot via YouTube)

The ALP’s review of its 2019 Election loss falls short of providing any real political answers to the party’s problems. Dr Martin Hirst argues the problem is that Labor long ago abandoned its social democratic roots.

WHILE ITS CRITICISMS of the ALP’s campaign strategy may well be accurate along with its insights into policy problems (such as franking credits), the report signally fails to examine the vexing issues with Labor’s overall political positioning and messaging.

To fully understand why the Australian electorate refused to elect a Bill Shorten government – bearing in mind that Scott Morrison has a one-seat majority and does not have control of the Senate – the reviewers should really have examined Labor’s decline historically.

That former Trade Minister Craig Emerson and former South Australian Premier Jay Weatherill were incapable of this political insight is itself a symptom of the bigger malaise affecting the ALP’s electoral stocks.

Voters have disconnected from Labor. Once reliable middle-class inner-city types have begun shifting to the Greens in significant numbers. These voters are largely motivated by social concerns rather than economics and cannot stomach the ALP’s continuing support for the illegal incarceration of refugees and asylum seekers in offshore detention.



Tracey Hoolachan
No ALP hasn't become a carbon copy of LNP Nazis "economic growth and job creation" is different to LNP's Jobs & Growth mantra - for God sake Australian Labor where have you gone?
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-11-07/ ... s/11680368
Live: Labor releases report into how it lost the election
Almost six months after Labor's election loss, the official autopsy into what went wrong for the party will be delivered. Follow the release live.



These voters are also motivated by environmental questions and Labor’s equivocation on the Adani mine gave them no reason to trust a Shorten-led government. The ALP’s dilemma over Adani – and coal mining in general – are perhaps greatest in Queensland where the Labor State Government is keen to give Adani the go-ahead because of some largely fictitious idea that it will create jobs and wealth (it won’t).

Shorten hid behind the hollow “due process” argument when pressed on Adani and the Greens used this effectively by describing the project as “Labor’s Adani coal mine”.

In the eyes of many voters, the modern ALP is difficult to distinguish from the conservatives. This is the result of several factors, including the Coalition’s ability to wedge Labor on some important issues such as refugee and energy (coal) policy as well as on philosophical issues where the ALP has lost its way.

This is apparent in Labor’s inability to recruit and hold young workers as it has done in previous generations. When I was becoming politically conscious at the beginning of the 1970s, it was clear to me that I had to vote Labor. There was a clear ideological demarcation between the Liberal Party and the ALP. Labor was the party of the trade union movement and the working class. The Liberals represented the upper class and the Country Party (Nationals) was for the graziers and broadacre farmers.

This is no longer true today. It is no more than a convenient myth that Labor parliamentarians pay lip service to, in order to cover their left flank in a dirty, torn and largely discredited red flag. In the 21st century ALP, the personal profiles of its parliamentary cadre are remarkably similar to those of the conservative parties. The only difference – and it is actually minor in the scheme of things – is that conservatives come up through the ranks of the Institute of Public Affairs and Labor’s best and brightest serve their apprenticeships in the union movement.

I call this a minor difference because both routes to the comfortable sinecure of a seat in the House or the Senate are via a well-entrenched system of privilege designed to test potential candidates for loyalty and to weed out the mavericks. Both are methods of producing trusted apparatchiks who owe their position to the party machine and who won’t stray too far from the ideological “centre”, which is actually way over on the right-hand side of any putative “middle” ground.



Stephen Mayne
Graham Richardson voted Liberal in the Federal election - the ultimate betrayal of his party. Is he still an ALP member? If so, why? https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation ... 6b4f8e47fb
I did not vote Liberal: Richo
After setting off a political firestorm by saying he voted Liberal at the federal election, former Labor powerbroker Graham Richardson says he actually meant he voted Dave Sharma before Independent...



We only have to look at the outliers to make this point. In this year’s election, all the major parties (and, of course, the lunatic fringe) had to unceremoniously dump candidates who had not been properly vetted and subsequently embarrassed themselves and their party.

Gladys Liu is the paradigm example on the conservative side. She is in witness protection now because of her gaffes (not to mention her dubious loyalty to the Chinese Communist Party).

On the Labor side, Emma Husar provides the obvious example. Her career, reputation and life were destroyed to bring her down after she proved to be unamenable to factional discipline.

This conveyor-belt system of preselecting “safe” representatives is indicative of the real problem the ALP faces today. It is no longer a true social democratic party and it no longer gives working-class electors any really solid reason to vote for it. Despite Bill Shorten’s links to the trade union movement, he was unable to persuade working-class voters in marginal Queensland seats that it would be in their interests to vote Labor.

This is where some sort of historical lens becomes useful for reviewing Labor’s failure in the election, but also for unpacking its longer-term demise as a genuine party of social democratic reform. Ben Chifley’s famous ”light on the hill” has been extinguished.


Social democracy was originally a term closely linked to the socialist movement of the late 19th and early 20th centuries. The organisations established by Marx and Engels were initially known as social-democratic. However, in 1914, the First World War caused the First International (founded by Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels) to split into those who opposed and those who supported their respective nations.

This division was particularly destructive on the German Left and was a factor in the failure of the post-war uprisings that culminated in the murder of Rosa Luxemburg and Karl Liebknecht by off-duty soldiers in January 1919. It was the social-democratic government of the day that sanctioned the killing of the revolutionary leaders.

The ALP joined the reformist Second International and remains a member of the global grouping – the Progressive Alliance network – that inherited the real social democratic tradition and trashed it.


Luke Mansillo
Labor election review blames strategy, adaptability and Bill Shorten for defeat ⁦@murpharoo⁩ I love how the ALP does its report before the Australian Election Study is released and avoids never asks academics with other data
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... SApp_Other
Labor election review blames strategy, adaptability and Bill Shorten for defeat
Labor went into May election with no agreed strategy, and policies were developed on the run, postmortem finds



When the first Australian Labor Government was elected in 1914, it was one of the first social democratic parties to achieve this level of electoral success anywhere in the world. But it is telling that this electoral victory came off the back of a series of industrial defeats during a strike wave in the ports, the mining and the pastoralist industries a decade earlier.

The ALP was founded as a distinct and explicit party of the working class, but by the 1980s it had completely abandoned this approach in favour of broad cross-class alliances, which inevitably led to outcomes more favourable to capital than to the working class.

The Whitlam Government was perhaps the most obvious and recent expression of the Left face of Australian social democracy. But by the time of Bob Hawke’s ascendency and triumph over Malcolm Fraser in 1983, any semblance of working-class identity was almost entirely erased. By the end of Hawke’s leadership, Paul Keating’s pragmatic neoliberalism in an ALP suit put the final nail in the coffin of Australian social democracy.


Recently retired long-serving leftwing senator Doug Cameron wrote, in 2003, that the Labor Party was still at that time fighting over its position on social democracy.

I believe there is an underlying issue that needs to be resolved: that is whether the Australian Labor Party will continue to have democratic socialism as its foundation, or whether we will see a complete convergence of Labor policy with the dominant neoclassical economic policies of the conservative parties in this country.

Cameron was a staunch believer in the reformist social democratic agenda, but he was never going to be a Labor leader. Anthony Albanese was a protégé, but he has abandoned any adherence he might once have had to leftwing ideas.

In fact, I would argue that the Labor Party abandoned any real commitment to social democracy at least 20 years before Cameron’s speech to the 2003 ALP National Conference.

No amount of internal agonising and squabbling over the minutiae of the 2019 election loss is going to undo this history. Returning Bill Shorten to the leadership and dumping Albanese is certainly not going to refresh the ALP or rejuvenate its ageing and dwindling base.

As Doug Cameron argued in his 2003 Conference address, the contemporary ALP has replaced its commitment to the "traditional blue-collar working class" with a "new postmodern political platform and identity for Labor".

Cameron also asked some very pertinent questions:

Where is the courageous Australian Left Labor politician who is exposing the rorts and public waste in privatisation and public-private partnerships?

Where is the courage to expose the scandalous low taxation paid by the rich in this country?

Where is the courage to expose the low level of public investment in our health, education and training systems when compared to other advanced economies?

Where is the courage to set out a clear program to shift the funding away from the elite in education and health and to expand and properly fund a world-class public system?


The answers to these questions will not be found in the Weatherill/Emerson review. The Labor Party is incapable of lifting such a figure from its ranks today.

Activists on the Left who hold out any hope at all of a leftwing revival in the Labor Party need to wake up and smell the reek of betrayal and neoliberal pandering emanating from ALP HQ.

https://independentaustralia.net/politi ... abor,13294

Juliar
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Re: Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by Juliar » Sun Dec 08, 2019 2:43 pm

Interesting comment.

42 Long
Democracy relies strongly. on an INFORMED vote of all eligible voters.

Today, misinformation peddling, fear confusion and character assassination wins the day.

Also the opposition members (individually) are just as elected as the winners, to represent their electorates.

If the (small) majority is "winner take all" and they are not required to be open and accountable like this lot who rely on secrecy greatly and move "the member be not heard" to silence an elected member of the Parliament.

How is that democracy?

let alone Palmer spending $70 Million to kill BILL and the LieNP about the same amount of "OUR money" on the rigged TURC for the same purpose.

Daily headlines of "alleged" matters for the MSM mainly Monopoly Murdoch anti Labor coverage working with the LIARS,very effectively.

The contest is pretty uneven and if we wish to talk of miracles it would be that Labor ever get elected.

Work for the well off and they will reward you as they have the means to do that in their own interests, and they do.

The LNP business plan always has that advantage and always will until contributions are more examined.. People/Companies don't throw money unless they get a dividend and have the money to throw in the first place..

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Black Orchid
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Re: Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by Black Orchid » Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:46 pm

Albo says no to stopping coal exports ...
Labor leader Anthony Albanese has backed the case for Australian coal exports amid a divisive debate on shutting down the trade to act on climate change, arguing it would be wrong to damage the industry and its workers.

Mr Albanese said Australia’s priority should be to reduce greenhouse gas emissions under strong global agreements but that this would not be achieved by stopping coal exports.

The Opposition Leader said other countries would fill the gap left by any halt to Australian coal exports, laying down a key principle amid a climate policy rift between Labor frontbencher Joel Fitzgibbon and Midnight Oil singer Peter Garrett.

“If Australia stopped exporting today there would not be less demand for coal – the coal would come from a different place,” Mr Albanese said in an interview.

“So it would not reduce emissions – which has to be the objective. I don’t see a contradiction between that and having a strong climate change policy.

“We’ve got to consider what the actual outcome is from any proposal, and the proposal that we immediately stop exporting coal would damage our economy and would not have any environmental benefit.”
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal ... 53hyp.html

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brian ross
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Re: Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by brian ross » Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:58 pm

No way, Jose' :stop
Nationalism is not to be confused with patriotism. - Eric Blair

Juliar
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Re: Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by Juliar » Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:07 pm

BRossy the extremist Greeny is horrified by Albo's backing of coal exports. Wonder if he will glue himself to something ?

Albo is copying all of ScoMo's winning recipes for success. Has Albo become a disciple of the people's Messiah ScoMo and following him to the light on the hill ?

But is Albo a lone voice in the wilderness of union and Greeny controlled Labor ? Is Albo a "temporary Leader" ? Is Shifty Shorty sniffing at his heels ?

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Neferti
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Re: Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by Neferti » Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:28 pm

Did anybody see the latest Newspoll? :D
The last Newspoll of the year shows the coalition leads Labor 52 per cent to 48 on a two-party-preferred basis, compared with 51 per cent to 49 a fortnight ago.
So all the yelling and shouting in Question Time was all show, as usual. :rofl


:thumb

Juliar
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Re: Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by Juliar » Mon Dec 09, 2019 6:08 pm

Neffy, there is even a thread about it up there.

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Neferti
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Re: Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by Neferti » Mon Dec 09, 2019 6:09 pm

Juliar wrote:
Mon Dec 09, 2019 6:08 pm
Neffy, there is even a thread about it up there.
Saw it after I posted. Thanks.

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Outlaw Yogi
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Re: Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by Outlaw Yogi » Mon Dec 09, 2019 10:32 pm

The ALP's been a basket case longer than I've been around (53) ... my oldies were members, the old lady was on more committees than I remember, (branch) fundraisers were held at our house/mansion.

The Labor Party doesn't stand for anything .. they're too fat to get out of their chairs.
If Donald Trump is so close to the Ruskis, why couldn't he get Vladimir Putin to put novichok in Xi Jjinping's lipstick?

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Bogan
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Re: Has Labor lost its way ?

Post by Bogan » Tue Dec 10, 2019 5:59 am

"Social democracy" is euphemism used by socialists to mean the gradual takeover of free market economies using taxpayer funded "free stuff" to buy the votes of whatever demographics are clamouring for "free stuff", to create a socialist economy.

Since socialism failed in every one of the 46 countries it was tried in, why somebody like Dr Martin Hirst would advocate that Labor is losing support from the electorate, because it will not go back to a failed economic model, looks potty to me. And this guy has a doctorate? Ok, Ok, so has Brian Ross. Perhaps studying for doctorates tranquilises the brain's ability to reason?
Dr Hirst wrote

Voters have disconnected from Labor. Once reliable middle-class inner-city types have begun shifting to the Greens in significant numbers. These voters are largely motivated by social concerns rather than economics and cannot stomach the ALP’s continuing support for the illegal incarceration of refugees and asylum seekers in offshore detention.
Voters have not disconnected from Labor becasue the right left balance is still around 50-50, as the Senate clearly displays. What is changing is the voter demographics who are Labor's electorate. Labor used to be the party of the white working class and the so called "disadvantaged" class who could be anything from those who have become poor through misfortune, to professional dole bludgers. But Labor is now the "Immigrants Party", a party which ignored it's own working class branch members for too long, and which is now a party run by union bosses and those who seek power through university educations.

The uni types look down their noses at the working class and advocate policies which harm the working class. So it is hardly surprising that the white working class and the white "disadvantaged" class are looking to One Nation as their representatives. One Nation is now the Labor Party.

However much labor would like to keep it's traditional voters, it is openly seeking the "multicultural" vote by pork barrelling any ethnic group who it thinks will vote as a group for it in the next election. In NSW the new Labor heartland comprises the six inner city Muslim infested ghettoes full of people who are very disproportionately represented in serious crime, endemic welfare dependency, and even terrorism. Nice electors you have there Labor. Unsurprisingly, Labor has turned it's back on Israel and now champions and defends the Islamic terrorist faith.

The Greens represent a different demographic. University educated people once only comprised 2% of the Australian population, and almost all of those were considered part of the Establishment. But today it is more like 15% and it represents a new and growing class. These people all think that they are God's gift to the human race and are smarter than the Deplorables and morally superior to the crass, commercial class, who are usually their parents.

Their entire psychology centres around proving to everybody just how smart and morally superior they are. Nothing else matters to them except heir personel self aggrandisement. We're all right, Jack. . They think that prosperity is a natural law of nature so they can do whatever they want when it comes to destroying their economy, just so that they can strut, preen, and virtue signal.

The Greens are an offshoot of Don Chip's Australian Democrat Party which supposedly stood midway between the Labor and the Liberal party. But the Dems imploded from internal squabbling and the Green party was born. Over time, it has moved so far to the Left that even Joseph Stalin would think that they were getting a bit extreme. Just like Labor, the Greens are after the Immigrant vote and especially the votes of those people who are members of the Islamic terrorist religion.

With immigration now at something like 200,000 a year, labor looks like they will win, eventually. Of course the Libs are aware of what labor is doing so they too have joined the race for the immigrant vote, although on a smaller scale. The Libs don't want to piss off their traditional votes too much, too many have already defected to One Nation. It is Tammany Hall politics in Australia.
Dr Hirst wrote

These voters are also motivated by environmental questions and Labor’s equivocation on the Adani mine gave them no reason to trust a Shorten-led government. The ALP’s dilemma over Adani – and coal mining in general – are perhaps greatest in Queensland where the Labor State Government is keen to give Adani the go-ahead because of some largely fictitious idea that it will create jobs and wealth (it won’t).
No, Dr Hirst. What these voters are primarily concerned with is their group identity as superior people, and their social separation from those hairy trade union knuckle draggers.
Dr Hirst wrote

In the eyes of many voters, the modern ALP is difficult to distinguish from the conservatives. This is the result of several factors, including the Coalition’s ability to wedge Labor on some important issues such as refugee and energy (coal) policy as well as on philosophical issues where the ALP has lost its way.
In the eyes of trendy lefties, that statement may be true. It just goes to show how far left the trendies have gone if they equate anybody to the right of Jeremy Corbin as a right winger.
Dr Hirst wrote

This is apparent in Labor’s inability to recruit and hold young workers as it has done in previous generations. When I was becoming politically conscious at the beginning of the 1970s, it was clear to me that I had to vote Labor. There was a clear ideological demarcation between the Liberal Party and the ALP. Labor was the party of the trade union movement and the working class. The Liberals represented the upper class and the Country Party (Nationals) was for the graziers and broadacre farmers.
I don't know from which planet you came from Dr Hirst, but young working class people are not, and never have been, interested in politics. Political activism is the hobby of the educated and upper classes. Workers would rather go fishin. However, Labor might be able to get working people interested in politics if it ever took any notice of their branch members resolutions. But the branches can send as many resolutions to the executive as they like, and they might as well just shout down a well for all the good that will do. The Labor Party is a club run by about 200 people, and what they want, goes.

Branch members are just there to hand out "how to vote" cards at the booths come election time. The branch members wishes for who should be their representatives in parliament is routinely over ruled by the executive, who 'parachute" their own cronies and celebrities into these posts, much to the anger of the ordinary, routinely shat upon, branch members.
Dr Hirst wrote

This is no longer true today. It is no more than a convenient myth that Labor parliamentarians pay lip service to, in order to cover their left flank in a dirty, torn and largely discredited red flag. In the 21st century ALP, the personal profiles of its parliamentary cadre are remarkably similar to those of the conservative parties. The only difference – and it is actually minor in the scheme of things – is that conservatives come up through the ranks of the Institute of Public Affairs and Labor’s best and brightest serve their apprenticeships in the union movement.

I call this a minor difference because both routes to the comfortable sinecure of a seat in the House or the Senate are via a well-entrenched system of privilege designed to test potential candidates for loyalty and to weed out the mavericks. Both are methods of producing trusted apparatchiks who owe their position to the party machine and who won’t stray too far from the ideological “centre”, which is actually way over on the right-hand side of any putative “middle” ground.
Hey! Look at that! Dr Hirst finally said something I agree with!

You are right, Dr Hirst. The white working classes of the western world have finally united to fight against a system being used against them by the educated classes of both the right and the left. Whether it is the yellow vests of France, the farmers in Holland, or the Brexit, One Nation, or Trump supporters. There is growing concern among the white working class that their political leaders on both the right and left are prepared to sell them out, and their country out, for their careers, their egos, their pecuniary interests, and their indexed linked pensions.

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