Fare thee well

[Jovial Monk]

I believe the above was quite mild compared to some earlier posts by you about Frogen, on Deepshit's PA2?

[cynik]

Yeah, well, I have sworn off it. Me talking about frogen is about the same as frogen drinking whiskey. Fun to watch, but futile and ultimately a complete waste of time and energy.

He can't be swayed, because he isn't in it for the reason or the understanding. Or the morals.

Frogen doesn't look out at the world and cherish it, he looks inwards at himself and tries to staunch the flow of fear.

You can't talk to a man like that. The bottle will take him, in its sweet time. And I have work to do. Let someone else reach out to that broken man.

[JW Frogen]

“They” cynik?

Well I suppose if one knows little and cares less about Afghanistan one can use the dismissive term “they”.

Which then becomes us versus “them”. (The peace crowd has never understood this dichotomy. We can be free, “they” really cannot, do not want to be. Western women can have rights, but Afgan women must submit slavery and subservience, to your peace on your TV screen.)

So in your mind, speaking for “them”, all Afghans, “they” all hate the West and US in general, not just the Pashtuns who were favored under the Talaban.

And so the courageous and desperate struggle of most Afghans to establish democracy under the threat of a violence no Western voter has had to face is not real, because you are cynical even if “they” are brave.

You are not brave, so “they” cannot be.

You do not feel free, so “they” cannot be.

It is not about them, it is all about you.

[mantra.]

Well I suppose if one knows little and cares less about Afghanistan one can use the dismissive term “they”.

Which then becomes us versus “them”. (The peace crowd has never understood this dichotomy. We can be free, “they” really cannot, do not want to be. Western women can have rights, but Afgan women must submit slavery and subservience, to your peace on your TV screen.)

According to the Coalition of the Willing - we invaded Afghanistan to hunt for the elusive Bin Laden. We didn't go in there to bring equality to the Afghan women and yes they were having a terrible time under the Taliban, but was their life any better prior to the Taliban or after our invasion? It can't only be the ideology of a democracy that justifies our occupation there. We have to look at the collateral damage created by the Coalition, in particular the US, I'm sorry to say. Afghanistan is littered with depleted uranium, their once lush country is a desert and opium exports have increased tenfold since we've been there.

Six years later and where's Osama? It's convenient that every year or so we get a video tape from him telling the world what his plan of action is for destroying the infidels. Is it to scare us and make us believe our governments are doing their very best to protect us by continuing these wars?

What a farce. There are so many excuses as to why we are there - none of them ring true. How many marines have lost their lives in Afghanistan and Iraq to date? How many Afghan & Iraqi citizens have been killed or maimed? How many refugees have fled these countries in the last few years?

[cynik]

Don't confuse frogen with details, mantra. You'll fuck up his lush kick.

Frogen, you are lecturing me about "us and them". Surely you understand the concept? After all, haven't you spent your life trying to kill them, on behalf of us?

Oh, wait. That was all a big lie. I forgot.

You are a joke, fatboy. You were wrong about everything from the start to the finish, because all you have ever done is to parrot the propaganda of the US military press. You screamed about WMD, you screamed that it was all about democracy, you screamed whatever bullshit was most effective at the time to make the US military look pure and wonderful.

THAT is what you are, frogen. Posing as some sort of civilian expert on anything is a bald farce, and a sneaking lie. You are pathetic.

[boxy]

Was this stunt more effective than terrorism?

[JW Frogen]

Why don’t we ask he women of Kabul?

Oh wait, you don’t care what they think, you hate war because it personally makes you upset.

It fucks with your posts on a forum or enjoyment of a Bob Dylan song.

How fucking noble.

[Outlaw Yogi]

Why don’t we ask he women of Kabul?

Oh wait, you don’t care what they think, you hate war because it personally makes you upset.

It fucks with your posts on a forum or enjoyment of a Bob Dylan song.

How fucking noble.

Someone genuinely concerned for the welbeing of Afgani women would not support and advocate on behalf of the original sponsors of the Taliban - US DoD on behalf of Unacol via Pakistan's ISI from 1995 to 2001. Control of opium production depends on which militarised political faction is allied with the CIA.
Invasion of Afganistan on the pretext of capturing a former CIA asset (Usama bin Laden) and crush an extremist regime of its own making (al Qa'ida backed Taliban) is just another example of U$A manufacturing enemies for itself to justify a state of perpetual war.

War is business, America is a war economy, and so Americans facilitate and wage war upon the rest of the world.

We Arm the World

A $7 billion missile-defense system for the United Arab Emirates. An estimated $15 billion potential sale of Lockheed Martin’s brand-new fighter plane to Israel. Billions of dollars in weaponry for Taiwan and Turkey. These and other recent deals helped make the United States the world’s leading arms-exporting nation.

In 2007, U.S. foreign military sales agreements totaled more than $32 billion — nearly triple the amount during President Bush’s first full year in office.

The Pentagon routinely justifies weapons sales as “promoting regional stability,” but many of these arms end up in the world’s war zones. In 2006 and 2007, the five biggest recipients of U.S. weapons were Pakistan ($3.5 billion), Iraq ($2.2 billion), Israel ($2.2 billion), Afghanistan ($1.9 billion) and Colombia ($580 million) — all countries where conflict rages.

In Pakistan, the fighting ranges from communal violence and state repression, to attacks against India, to deadly battles between Pakistani military and al Qaeda forces in the northwest provinces. Israel has used U.S.-supplied weapons in the West Bank and Gaza, as well as in the 2006 invasion of Lebanon. Colombia uses U.S. weaponry to fight the drug war. Of the 27 major conflicts during 2006 and 2007, 19 of them involved U.S-supplied weapons.

While full data is not yet available for 2008, the United States continues to flood warzones with more destabilizing weapons. In 2008, the Pentagon brokered more than $12.5 billion in possible foreign military sales to Iraq, including guns, ammunition, tanks and attack helicopters.

According to Stohl, “The Bush administration has demonstrated a willingness to provide weapons and military training to weak and failing states and countries that have been repeatedly criticized by the U.S. State Department for human rights violations, lack of democracy and even support of terrorism.”

http://inthesetimes.com/article/4120/we_arm_the_world

[mantra.]

War is business, America is a war economy, and so Americans facilitate and wage war upon the rest of the world.

How true Heretic. Unfortunately some believe otherwise thanks to the great hatchet job Howard did convincing Australia that the world was over-run with terrorists and we needed to look over our shoulder constantly. Thanks to Bush & Associates this has become a reality. We can only hope there are some serious policy changes in the new US administration. They're going to have to cut back in some areas because they're in such a mess financially.

I just heard a news flash - it looks like Bush Senior has plans for his younger son Jethro to become President one day. God help us.

[Hebe]

God help us.

I think he needs help more than we do. Surely they wouldn't elect another Bush????