Indigenous People

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The Reboot
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by The Reboot » Fri Sep 13, 2019 6:06 pm

Another double standard, that one goes in your "clangers" file. Your "logic" is, when the Southern redneck racists did it, it was absolutely evil and reprehensible. And we are only doing exactly what the racists did, so you can't condemn us. Yeah, that makes sense. Would you like to think that one through again, Brian?
Childish, if you ask me. But hey, that's no surprise. He has the mind of a child -- perhaps he claimed he was an Aboriginal when he did his 50,000 uni degrees. It's the only way I can see him passing.

This is what it sounds like, dickhead. "They did it so I'm gonna do it back. Ner ner ner."

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Bogan
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by Bogan » Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:25 pm

Yeah, Reboot. Brian Ross, the moral posturing, virtue signalling, pillar of moral virtue, who never stops piously wagging his fingers at every body else, is confronted by a moral problem in which his aboriginal grievance industry is clearing taking an immoral racist position, and he justifies it by saying that it is OK for his side to be racist because southern white racists in America did the same thing.

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The Reboot
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by The Reboot » Fri Sep 13, 2019 9:07 pm

Bogan wrote:
Fri Sep 13, 2019 7:25 pm
Yeah, Reboot. Brian Ross, the moral posturing, virtue signalling, pillar of moral virtue, who never stops piously wagging his fingers at every body else, is confronted by a moral problem in which his aboriginal grievance industry is clearing taking an immoral racist position, and he justifies it by saying that it is OK for his side to be racist because southern white racists in America did the same thing.
He's not alone on "that side". Apparently anti-white racism doesn't exist... but white privilege is "very real". (Just check out the Pauline Hanson thread that the tosser started, it's a tweet his latest post after Hanson posted something about anti whites on Twitter... she got laughed at and ganged up on. Such an understanding, equal society we have)

Here's an interesting article I found on the subject, after trudging through progressive BS.
Reverse Racism: Does It Really Exist?
No way, says the progressive. Why would he, or she, say that?

The organizers of a half-marathon in the northern Italian city of Trieste have been accused of racism over their decision to exclude African athletes from the race, which takes place on May 5. Racism is abhorrent, full stop.

What about reverse racism? Does it even exist?

Sociologist Eduardo Bonilla-Silva famously labeled the concept of reverse racism “nonsensical.” In a 2010 interview with the TheGrio.com, the author had this to say:

“When whites talk about reverse discrimination, I feel that they are making a silly argument because what they really want to say is that we, people of color, have the power to do to them what they have done to us from the 13th century.”

According to Bonilla-Silva, some people of color are prejudiced against whites; however, they lack the power to discriminate against whites on a systemic scale. White people, in his words, “control” the economic and political landscapes that govern the United States.

I am not here to deny the fact that white people, for centuries, have oppressed people of color. Only a pigheaded moron would argue otherwise. I am here to discuss racism, which can be defined as “prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race.” The whole concept of power is a moot point. Historically speaking, men have been the dominant force in society. Women have suffered at the hands of men. However, nobody denies that men are harassed by women in the workplace, in marriages, etc. Misandry exists.

Dear, White People

In Dear White People, a 2014 American comedy-drama film, a character states that “black people can’t be racist. Prejudiced, yes, but not racist. Racism describes a system of disadvantage based on race. Black people can’t be racists since we don’t stand to benefit from such a system.” What a clever way of circumventing truth. This character’s argument — that minorities can’t be racist because they lack the power to act on such ill feeling — is deeply misleading. Today, there are no restrictions on which races can be the instigators of pain. Racism can occur at an individual, not just an institutional, level. It is important to remember that millions of white people are not in positions of power. Millions of white people do not come from places of privilege. It perplexes me that so many absolve non-white people of racism. The next time someone argues that it is “literally impossible to be racist to a white person,” or that “racism against white people doesn’t exist,” ask them if they are familiar with Sarah Jeong.

In 2018, the New York Times appointed Sarah Jeong to its editorial board, a journalist with a history of posting numerous racist tweets (“Dumbass f***ing white people,” “White people are bulls**t,” “White people should be cancelled”). One wonders how you “cancel” white people.

Anyway, shortly after her appointment, unsurprisingly, people were quick to voice their anger. In response, Jeong released a public statement saying that she, an Asian female, had been the recipient of sexist and racist abuse on social media for years. Here, the phrase “two wrongs don’t make a right” instantly springs to mind. These tweets, she argued, were not racist. They were satirical in nature. She was merely “counter-trolling”; and here I was thinking Jeong was just being racist. Silly me.

Jeong, many argued, should never have been hired, and she certainly shouldn’t have been appointed to an editorial position. However, the board of the New York Times doubled down, acknowledging that although the members didn’t look favorably on her past tweets, they recognized the context in which they were made: “For a period of time she responded to harassment by imitating the rhetoric of her harassers.”

If Jeong had used the words “trans,” “Muslim,” or “black,” would she still have a job? I think we all know the answer to this question.

More recently, just a few months ago, a man by the name of Matthew Furlong applied for a position with Cheshire Police in the UK. Furlong wanted to follow in the footsteps of his father, who is a serving detective inspector on the force.

Furlong passed the interview stage of the recruitment process. He was praised for being “well-prepared.” In their report, the interviewers said that Furlong “could not have done any more” in his effort to make a favorable impression. Nevertheless, an offer was never made. Why?

Technically speaking, under the Equality Act of 2010, British employers cannot discriminate against people on the basis of certain “protected characteristics.” These include race, sex, and sexuality. Nevertheless, if they wish to, they can choose candidates from specific groups over others — usually white people, and in particular white men — if they are of “equal merit.” Some refer to this process, rather disingenuously, as positive discrimination.

But, as you shall see, this was an example of racism in its purest form. Representatives for the police force claimed that they had received applications from 127 other candidates, many of them just as qualified as Furlong. Matthew’s father was having none of it. He lodged a complaint with Cheshire Police. After an employment tribunal carried out an investigation, a damning report was issued. The tribunal ruled the force had used “positive action” to recruit people with different characteristics, but in a discriminatory way. In an interview with the BBC, Jennifer Ainscough, a prominent employment lawyer, said: “Matthew was denied his dream job simply because he was a white, heterosexual male. This is the first reported case of its kind in the UK where positive action has been used in a discriminatory way.” I referred to positive discrimination as being somewhat disingenuous for a legitimate reason. Positive action can be used to boost diversity, but it should only be applied to differentiate between candidates who were all equally well qualified for a role. Furlong, clearly a qualified candidate, was a victim of direct discrimination on the grounds of his sexual orientation, race, and sex.

Gratuitous use of race

When it comes to the bashing of white people, the “trend” is as prevalent as it is undeniably racist. As you’ve probably noticed, criticizing white people, especially straight white men, is very much in style. It’s impossible to escape — from the Daily Beast to the HuffPost, largely because of Trump’s rise to power, it’s now acceptable to casually attack white people, especially white men.

The gratuitous inclusion of race even when it isn’t applicable, as during the Brett Kavanaugh hearings, has become more frequent. Vox, just a few months ago, published an article titled “Lindsey Graham, Brett Kavanaugh, and the unleashing of white male backlash.” These weren’t normal angry men… oh no, these were angry white men.

When it comes to highlighting the dangers posed by white men, look no further than the McGill Daily, an independent student newspaper at Canada’s McGill University. In February of this year, the paper published a lengthy diatribe against white males. The letter, written by, and I quote, a “woman of colour,” begins in an acrimonious manner:

Dear White Boys in Poli Sci,

I wonder what your lives must be like. I always wonder this when I see you clustered in the hallways, or standing in the aisles of lecture halls, not realizing how much room you take up. You just stand there, so unapologetic, as the sea of people parts around you. I wonder this when you play devil’s advocate in class and you think you’re being clever, but you’re just sh**ting on someone else’s personhood. I wonder this when youtalk over other people, or comment on what the professor is saying without raising your hand, as if a lecture is just a dialogue that only the two of you can engage in.”

The letter continues: “I wonder this when you spread yourself out on your desk so that your things spill over onto mine, and you don’t apologize, but instead continue as if nothing is wrong — meanwhile, I am too passive to say anything.”

Here, the writer appears to have experienced desk annexation, where one greedy individual, the academic equivalent of Genghis Khan, gains desk dominance by scattering sheets and pens everywhere.

The writer, clearly perturbed by this attempt at desk displacement, continues: “I wonder this when you exist so loudly and so largely because you’ve been allowed to exist like this your whole life, and I am left to carefully defend the scraps of space that I have left. So this is a letter to you. For all the times I have wanted to punch you in the mouth and refrained, here’s to you.”

The appeal of victimhood culture cannot be understated. If one is to emerge triumphant in the Oppression Olympics, he or she must create a narrative steeped in agony and inequality. The writer, fully aware of this, goes on to say:

The term “white guy in poli sci” is of course a generalization because all sorts of people can be downright awful. However, the white guy represents the apex of privilege, and I do sincerely believe that this, and other groups who are so privileged in some respects, can be ignorant to the struggles of others. Therefore I use the term only to represent the height of privilege. But by all means, if you recognize any of these types of behaviours in yourself regardless of race,gender, sexual orientation, religion, class, etc., feel free to identify with them and ask yourself, “why do I act like such an a**hole?”

Notice how the writer acknowledges the “white guy” generalization, albeit disingenuously, yet continues to generalize.

The aggrieved then asks: “You might be wondering, what could possibly be so upsetting to inspire such a lengthy diatribe?”

In great detail, she goes on to recount the most harrowing of tales. In a university class, where hundreds of people were gathered to engage in political debate, a “white boy” had the audacity to disagree with her opinion. The writer, clearly not comfortable with idea of opinionated colleagues, writes:

You asked me if I could just stop cutting you off and let you finish your argument. I wanted to yell. I wanted to scream and flip a table and throw myself on the ground and rip myself in half. I didn’t want to hear what you had to say anymore. I felt bad for your own body. Your own muscles and vocal cords were plagued with the task of speaking your amazingly ignorant words. I was emotional because my hopes and ambitions were up for debate. Did my voice really need to be heard? Do women really need to be treated as equals? The answer is a stupid, and painfully indisputable YES. And here I was, talking to some dude who pulls up in a Patagonia sweater and acts like these and my own existence were up for debate.

Notice the Patagonia reference. In case you forgot, the writer is dealing with a white male.

The lengthy rant finishes in a bombastic manner:

To the guy in the Conservative Association on campus who wore a “Make Canada Great Again” hat courtesy of Rebel Media: f*** you. It was Activities Night and you made me f***ing scared for what poli sci here might be like because I thought it might be filled with the likes of you. I believe that the MAGA hat, in all its incarnations, is an act of violence and if you’re reading (if anyone knows this guy please direct him to this letter), just know that what you wear is not about “free speech” in some a**hole Jordan Peterson way. It is dehumanizing and offensive and you disgust me.

Two takeaway points from this letter, folks:

1) White men are bad.

2) Wearing a MAGA hat is an act of violence.


Regardless of the color of the perpetrator’s skin, there’s no scenario in which racism is not atrocious. This need to compare how a possible act of racism would differ if perpetrated against, say, black people or white is not just idiotic, it’s plain wrong. Racism permeates every nook and cranny of society. It comes in many different forms. Sometimes it’s subtle, and sometimes it’s overt. Sometimes it’s violent, like a police shooting, and sometimes it’s “harmless,” like an ill-advised tweet or a lengthy diatribe in a student newspaper. It’s important to remember that even when racist remarks are directed against groups that haven’t been historically stigmatized, they still perpetuate a cycle of dissolution and antipathy.
Source

As you can see -- just like the twat in question -- certain people believe racism against whites is justified cause "whites are privileged and blacks were oppressed" a completely narrow minded assumption when not all white folks come from a background of privilege. Hell, according to that white racism can't even exist.

Now, if Bwian wants to wallow in his white guilt -- by all means, do so. All he needs to do is give up his house, his assets, his family and give all of his money to the boongs.

Just don't expect everybody to follow that path... not that he will anyway. I have brought that point up at least two times before and the inbred piece of shit runs away with his tail between his legs.

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brian ross
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by brian ross » Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:35 pm

Oh, dearie, dearie, me. A long quote? Bogan will be annoyed. He hates the use of quotes to back an argument, Reboot. Your love affair with him will be dead - or will it? :roll: :roll:
Nationalism is not to be confused with patriotism. - Eric Blair

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The Reboot
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by The Reboot » Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:48 pm

Oh deary deary me, if he doesn't want to read the quote he can view the source instead, by clicking on the link. :roll: it's much easier to read, I just highlighted relevant parts from that article.

"Love affair"? :rofl is that all you got, Bwiny? Could it be you have no argument against what I've posted, so now you're resorting to childish insults?

It's about time you ran back to the kiddie's playground. The mud is calling you. Tsk tsk. :roll: :roll:

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billy the kid
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by billy the kid » Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:57 pm

The mans a fkn moron....tsk...tsk.... :rofl
To discover those who rule over you, first discover those who you cannot criticize...Voltaire
Its coming...the rest of the world versus islam....or is it here already...

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Black Orchid
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by Black Orchid » Sat Sep 14, 2019 3:53 pm

brian ross wrote:
Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:35 pm
Oh, dearie, dearie, me. A long quote? Bogan will be annoyed. He hates the use of quotes to back an argument, Reboot. Your love affair with him will be dead - or will it? :roll: :roll:
Not at all Brian. Bogan said he hates links AS an argument without a summary of one's point of view in their own words. I find that quite reasonable and it is something that Reboot clearly did, in her own words, to back up the link she posted.

No soup for you!

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brian ross
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by brian ross » Sat Sep 14, 2019 4:31 pm

Black Orchid wrote:
Sat Sep 14, 2019 3:53 pm
brian ross wrote:
Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:35 pm
Oh, dearie, dearie, me. A long quote? Bogan will be annoyed. He hates the use of quotes to back an argument, Reboot. Your love affair with him will be dead - or will it? :roll: :roll:
Not at all Brian. Bogan said he hates links AS an argument without a summary of one's point of view in their own words. I find that quite reasonable and it is something that Reboot clearly did, in her own words, to back up the link she posted.
Except he attacked Nom for doing exactly what - using a long quote which made her argument for her, Black Orchid. It was obvious that he didn't even bother to read what she had quoted. He merely attacked her for her use of a long quote. Time for you to learn to read, methinks, Black Orchid. :roll:
No soup for you!
I don't want your gnat's piss that you call soup! :roll:
Nationalism is not to be confused with patriotism. - Eric Blair

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Black Orchid
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by Black Orchid » Sat Sep 14, 2019 4:43 pm

brian ross wrote:
Sat Sep 14, 2019 4:31 pm
Black Orchid wrote:
Sat Sep 14, 2019 3:53 pm
brian ross wrote:
Sat Sep 14, 2019 2:35 pm
Oh, dearie, dearie, me. A long quote? Bogan will be annoyed. He hates the use of quotes to back an argument, Reboot. Your love affair with him will be dead - or will it? :roll: :roll:
Not at all Brian. Bogan said he hates links AS an argument without a summary of one's point of view in their own words. I find that quite reasonable and it is something that Reboot clearly did, in her own words, to back up the link she posted.
Except he attacked Nom for doing exactly what - using a long quote which made her argument for her, Black Orchid. It was obvious that he didn't even bother to read what she had quoted. He merely attacked her for her use of a long quote. Time for you to learn to read, methinks, Black Orchid. :roll:
No soup for you!
I don't want your gnat's piss that you call soup! :roll:
Au contraire Brian it is you who needs to learn to read and comprehend. There is a HUGE difference between using a long quote solely as an argument (with no added reasoning in your own words) as opposed to using a quote to compliment and back up your summary of the argument.

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Bogan
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Re: Indigenous People

Post by Bogan » Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:47 pm

OK Brian, just this once, I will accept NDP's cut and paste submission, because it has been a slow day and I am looking for some action.

Races may exist in humans in a cultural sense, but biological concepts of race are needed to access their reality in a non-species-specific manner and to see if cultural categories correspond to biological categories within humans.
This is a classic example of "diseased English." That is, to say a simple concept in such a complicated way that it is almost incomprehensible. It sounds authoritative because it is meant to sound authoritative. It's purpose is to be unclear and in so doing confuse any person who thinks that the high falutin' language means that the author really knows what he or she is talking about. It won't work on me.

Races exist in a direct observation sense because the three primary races are identifiably different to one another.
Modern biological concepts of race can be implemented objectively with molecular genetic data through hypothesis-testing. Genetic data sets are used to see if biological races exist in humans and in our closest evolutionary relative, the chimpanzee. Using the two most commonly used biological concepts of race, chimpanzees are indeed subdivided into races but humans are not. Adaptive traits, such as skin color, have frequently been used to define races in humans, but such adaptive traits reflect the underlying environmental factor to which they are adaptive and not overall genetic differentiation, and different adaptive traits define discordant groups.
What this gobbledegook is pretending to be is a scientific report. One of the primary tasks of science is the classification of everything, including human and animal species and sub species. Race is simply a classification of humans which has been used in since science even came into being. Forensic anthropologists are scientists and the police use these scientists to identify the race of unknown human skeletons. Anthropologists themselves are intensely interested in determining the race of unknown skeletons in historical excavations.
There are no objective criteria for choosing one adaptive trait over another to define race.
Rubbish. The "objective data" which characterises the three primary races (Yellow, black and white) are their skin colour.
As a consequence, adaptive traits do not define races in humans.
Yes they do. White skin is an adaptive trait to cold weather where humans wear clothes to protect against the cold and UV radiation.
Much of the recent scientific literature on human evolution portrays human populations as separate branches on an evolutionary tree. A tree-like structure among humans has been falsified whenever tested, so this practice is scientifically indefensible. It is also socially irresponsible as these pictorial representations of human evolution have more impact on the general public than nuanced phrases in the text of a scientific paper. Humans have much genetic diversity, but the vast majority of this diversity reflects individual uniqueness.
How does this gobbledegook nullify the fact that the three primary races are identifiably different, and that is observable reality?
Many human societies classify people into racial categories.
So the practice is universal. Which proves that making generalisations about abstract concepts can hardly be wrong if everybody does it.

These categories often have very real effects politically, socially, and economically.
That doesn't negate the concept that races are identifiably different and recognisable. The author is trying to use a spurious moral argument to deny an observable reality.
Even if race is culturally real, that does not mean that these societal racial categories are biologically meaningful.
Most people don't give a damn about what is biologically meaningful. They simply categorise observable reality so that they can form simple concepts to think.
For example, individuals who classify themselves as “white” in Brazil are often considered “black” in the U.S.A., and many other countries use similar or identical racial terms in highly inconsistent fashions (Fish, 2002). This inconsistency is only reinforced when examined genetically. For example, Lao et al. (2010) assessed the geographical ancestry of self-declared “whites” and “blacks” in the United States by the use of a panel of geographically informative genetic markers. It is well known that the frequencies of alleles vary over geographical space in humans. Although the differences in allele frequencies are generally very modest for any one gene, it is possible with modern DNA technology to infer the geographical ancestry of individuals by scoring large numbers of genes. Using such geographically informative markers, self-identified “whites” from the United States are primarily of European ancestry, whereas U.S. “blacks” are primarily of African ancestry, with little overlap in the amount of African ancestry between self-classified U.S. “whites” and “blacks”. In contrast, Santos et al. (2009) did a similar genetic assessment of Brazilians who self-identified themselves as “whites”, “browns”, and “blacks” and found extensive overlap in the amount of African ancestry among all these “races”. Indeed, many Brazilian “whites” have more African ancestry than some U.S. “blacks”. Obviously, the culturally defined racial categories of “white” and “black” do not have the same genetic meanings in the United States and Brazil. The inconsistencies in the meaning of “race” across cultures and with genetic ancestry provide a compelling reason for a biological-based, culture-free definition of race.
What this gobbledegook is trying to say, in as complicated and presumably authoritative way as it can, is that since generalisations are not completely accurate, then they are invalid. That is like saying that you can't say "a flock of birds" because "flock" could be any number and the statement does not say what kind of birds they are. That is nonsense. The term "a flock of birds" does not need to be mathematically or biologically correct, only correct enough to form a concept so people can think. The term race is a generalised concept. It does not need to be absolutely correct, only correct enough to form a concept.

Another reason is that humans are the product of the same evolutionary processes that have led to all the other species on this planet. The subdivision of a species into groups or categories is not unique to our species.
This statement is a bizarre. And reading on I don't see how it is taken out of context because the following statement goes onto talk about some other nonsense. . The author first implies that there is another reason why races don't exist, then admits that classifying life forms is not
"not unique to our species." What he is saying, I haven't got a clue. Is he suggesting that it is wrong to classify all species? Not just humans? That is what he appears to be saying.
Since evolutionary biology deals with all life on this planet, biologists need a definition of race that is applicable to all species. A definition of “race” that is specific to one human culture at one point of time in its cultural history is inadequate for this purpose.
Well, to start off with, we don't usually use the term "race" with all species, only humans. And calling humans "the human race" satisfies the requirement that this term can be used as a generalisation for all humans. But that does not mean it can not be used to describe sub species of humans if humans wish it so. That may upset the Thought Police but they do yet have the authority to police the language in western countries.
Therefore, a universal, culture-free definition of race is required before the issue of the existence of races in humans (or any other species) can be addressed in a biological context.
No it does not. The term "race" is a generalised concept like "flock" "fleet", "coven" "multitude", "herd", "near", "far" or "crowd". Like word such as "legion" or "regiment" it can mean something specific or general, depending upon how it is used in context." Trying to wish away the meaning of words is the silliest argument against the idea that races are not equal.

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