Do Women Who Have Killed, Claim Life Does Not Begin At

[JW Frogen]

Abortion is killing a life.

At what point of time in the term is 'abortion the killing of a life?'

Let's say Mrs Frogen had a one night stand and conceived although she was totally unaware of that. As is her habit, she takes the morning after pill.

Has she killed a life?

The morning after pill is taken to stop what?

Preventing the birth of a Hyundai Getz?

Yes, she has killed a life.

[JW Frogen]

Good point Aussie. If Frogen was 16 years old and had just got a 16 y.o. first timer pregnant - would he stand by her through the pregnancy and do the right thing or encourage her to have an abortion?

So you are saying that the definition of life depends on what we decide to do?

I think you are making my point for me.

[JW Frogen]

You supply a single sperm .. that is the extent of any mans contribution...

I don't know, most of my bank balance, most of my time, and most of my dreams would suggest I provide much more for the child I did not kill.

[JW Frogen]

Indeed abortion, or the killing of an unborn life would be the preferred option of the man who does not want to provide anything other than sperm.

[Auzgurl]

You supply a single sperm .. that is the extent of any mans contribution...

I don't know, most of my bank balance, most of my time, and most of my dreams would suggest I provide much more for the child I did not kill.

That is just such a nonsense Frogen..women who are in relationships and cared for do not generally abort .It is women who have been raped or abandoned that seek abortion and who would judge them for this, not me.

So in that context how could your bank balance/dreams fit into this scenario?
I do agree that abortion should not be used AS contraception by successfully married and/or indeed by emancipated women..those who have the freedom to choose in other words. Nor would i agree with gender specfic abortion..selecting the sex of a child and using abortion for this is unforgiveable.

[JW Frogen]

You are making two different arguments here. And they contridict each other.

One, men have no say in what is a life and two life is not life until a woman decides it is a life, all in order to make it easy for you to kill the life should you need to.

They contradict each other, for if a man has no right to say when a life is a life then he has no responsibility for that life ever.

The woman called all the shots in your moral world and so she must bare all the responsibility.

What I am saying is both people created that life, they must acknowledge that it is a life (for their own human dignity) and they may, or may not, have to kill it.

If they do, they need to understand what they did. It may be justified, but it cannot be justified if they never considered really what they were doing.

This principal applies to any woman abandoned by the man as well, what she needs to do does not change the reality of what she is doing.

[JW Frogen]

Bumper sticker version.

The man has been in there.

He is for abortion because he wants out of there.

Though this needs a big bumper, Oprah’s ass for instance.

[Aussie]

Abortion is killing a life.

At what point of time in the term is 'abortion the killing of a life?'

Let's say Mrs Frogen had a one night stand and conceived although she was totally unaware of that. As is her habit, she takes the morning after pill.

Has she killed a life?

The morning after pill is taken to stop what?

Preventing the birth of a Hyundai Getz?

Yes, she has killed a life.

....and if she made the Dude wear a condom, would that be attempted killing of a life?

[JW Frogen]

No, it would be not creating a life, not killing a life.

The two concepts are very different.

And I am explaining this to adults.

No wonder I drink!

[Auzgurl]

You are making two different arguments here. And they contridict each other.

One, men have no say in what is a life and two life is not life until a woman decides it is a life, all in order to make it easy for you to kill the life should you need to.

Sometimes Frogen there is a harsh reality that we must all come to accept at some point...if ITS NOT the womans right to decide what is morally and physically bearable for her and her future .. who's is it?

For it is she is the sole carer for a child usually abandoned by a man who only wanted to donate sperm , this can also include husbands sometimes too..it all gets a bit much and off they go . So if a women has to ask herself where does this life of single motherhood take me..not having any choices regarding my life because I have been left with a child? The man is usually free to go about blithely inseminating as many as he so wishes..what a stud, what a star.

They contradict each other, for if a man has no right to say when a life is a life then he has no responsibility for that life ever.

You could very well be right there..there are not too many men who have a real conscience or affinity for the life they have created..they actually appear contemptous of the woman for being "stupid" enough to become preganant in the first place. Any man who stands by a women he has gotten pregnant is touted as a good bloke "he stood by her and his child"..those statemants say much...they say its not the norm, that men generally arent interested in the end result of a few moments of pleasure, that the pleasure is the be all and end all for him, dont bother me with details baby.

You men handed all this power to women by your indifference to your own flesh..

The woman called all the shots in your moral world and so she must bare all the responsibility.

Number 1..its not MY moral worldf..your words reflect a blantant sterotyping of how women see their role in relation to childbirth, being mothers and how they see men..and you just assume that women want to assume all the responsibily do you..that she is so bound up by her own code of morality that all she fucking wants to do is screw men over and prouduce a fatherless tribe ..resigned to a life of being downtrodden and ostracised by society for being a sole parent ? Yeah us wome sure have got it good. I'm sure given a choice a lot would opt out pretty quick..this is where abortion comes in obviously . So you believe men have the choice to run off and shirk their role then say that women have no choice???

What I am saying is both people created that life, they must acknowledge that it is a life (for their own human dignity) and they may, or may not, have to kill it.

In a perfect world Frogen, you are absolutely right..but its far from perfect I'm afraid. It comes back to a much deeper respect by men for a womans role in society. Think about that. If women felt more respected by men there would be hardly any need for abortion at all. Apart from genetic abnormalties

If they do, they need to understand what they did. It may be justified, but it cannot be justified if they never considered really what they were doing.

This principal applies to any woman abandoned by the man as well, what she needs to do does not change the reality of what she is doing.

So you tell me then the ideal outcome for a woman abandoned by the man..how can she live an optimal life in poverty and social isolation.. dont assume the woman comes from an wealthy extended family..assume she is alone..dont assume CAS will find the barstard and extract child payments from him..not a reality Im afraid.