Compulsory Voting - YES or NO?

[mantra]

It is already so easy for branch stacking to occur. You go to a polling booth - no ID - get your name marked off. You go to the next booth up the road and do the same thing. Sometimes there are a dozen booths covering one area - possibly more so you go to each one. If we didn't have to vote - this slack system would be even easier to rort. How would people who don't bother voting know whether someone else has used their name? They don't know. You can be fined for not voting, but I don't think anyone would complain if they didn't get a fine.

Why on earth would ANYBODY be bothered to do such a thing? Sure, it could, perhaps, be done but ...... why? I doubt Aussies are so hell bent on their local Pollie getting in ..... geeze.

Plenty of people would be bothered if they thought they could get away with it and they do. Our checks and balances are useless. Do you ever wonder why we have so many slimy and/or corrupt politicians? Some of them would have plenty of friends and family to help with the branch stacking and benefit from their relative or friend becoming a politician.

Last week, I did a Pre-Poll vote for the first time. They didn't ask for an excuse as to why you were voting early. They didn't ask for ID. They ticked your name off on a laptop and gave you a card to swipe so that you could register you vote ELECTRONICALLY. Apparently, about 45,000 plus Canberrans did the pre-poll voting (goes for 3 weeks, I think, before the actual polling day), I think there were 256,000 or so eligible voters on the Canberra Rolls. Don't quote me.

PS Tomorrow (midnight) is the cut off for Postal Votes for the Canberra Election. After that they will start counting preferences. It is not decided yet who will be Chief Minister of Canberra.

Canberra is a little like other country towns, we now have 370,000+ people here but we do not have a 3 tier system. The (useless) ACT Government does all the Council stuff (bins, roads, etc) but are also responsible for Health and Education ..... the so-called important stuff. This time around most people felt it was time for a change after 12 years of ALP (last 4 years with Greens). Everyone I know voted Liberal. Some are swinging voters. We will see what we see. But life will go on in this place where Politicians only visit when Parliament is Sitting.

The end result will be interesting. I heard today that there were 8 Labor seats, 8 Coalition seats and 1 seat for the Greens.

[Neferti]

Plenty of people would be bothered if they thought they could get away with it and they do. Our checks and balances are useless. Do you ever wonder why we have so many slimy and/or corrupt politicians? Some of them would have plenty of friends and family to help with the branch stacking and benefit from their relative or friend becoming a politician.

Obviously the people you know are different to mine. I can NOT imagine any of my associates doing such a thing and recklessly putting themselves in danger of a time in the Nik.

The end result will be interesting. I heard today that there were 8 Labor seats, 8 Coalition seats and 1 seat for the Greens.

There is NO Coalition in Canberra ........ except the ALP and Greens Coalition. It is LIBERAL PARTY ONLY here.

The Federal Coalition is the Liberal Party and the National Party (used to be the Country Party) they have been a Coalition since Menzies. NOTHING to do with Greens sucking up to the Laborites to get into power so cease and desist thinking that way. OK?

[Rorschach]

Obviously - but I wasn't talking about altering votes during voting hours. There would be no need. The same person could come back 20 times and mark off a different name each time and the people managing the booths wouldn't have a clue.

When I said the booth is opened I didn't mean just for the voters, I meant for counting after the ballot was closed as well. I know you stated that people could go from booth to booth multiple voting under an id.
How would they know what name to use? I suppose they could use their own. So they get 12 extra votes... the commission does make allowances for that sort of thing. And sometimes, not often, a ballot is taken again.
Oh and BTW branch stacking is when a party stacks their own branch not votes fraudulently in an election.

For starters the person in control of each booth knows how many people should be voting at the booth and all up in the election any noticeable variability would be questioned. I have already pointed out the only way you can really cheat an election.

Most ballots are not won by the odd vote... if they are they are usually challenged and a recount takes place.
You are supposed to vote in PENCIL. Because that is what they provide.
People counting ballots are watched by scrutineers from each party, mistakes in counting, challenges to invalids or even an attempt to cheat (by rubbing out and altering a number) would in all honesty be seen.

The ALP are known to have dead people vote for them. Even so there are not enough dead people voting to change the outcome of an election.

[mantra]

Plenty of people would be bothered if they thought they could get away with it and they do. Our checks and balances are useless. Do you ever wonder why we have so many slimy and/or corrupt politicians? Some of them would have plenty of friends and family to help with the branch stacking and benefit from their relative or friend becoming a politician.

Obviously the people you know are different to mine. I can NOT imagine any of my associates doing such a thing and recklessly putting themselves in danger of a time in the Nik.

How do you fit people "I know" into the equation? Politicians have been caught branch stacking in the past - but only by chance.

The end result will be interesting. I heard today that there were 8 Labor seats, 8 Coalition seats and 1 seat for the Greens.

There is NO Coalition in Canberra ........ except the ALP and Greens Coalition. It is LIBERAL PARTY ONLY here.

The Federal Coalition is the Liberal Party and the National Party (used to be the Country Party) they have been a Coalition since Menzies. NOTHING to do with Greens sucking up to the Laborites to get into power so cease and desist thinking that way. OK?

Stop being so hostile. I heard the results on the news. I've made no suppositions.

[Neferti]

Plenty of people would be bothered if they thought they could get away with it and they do. Our checks and balances are useless. Do you ever wonder why we have so many slimy and/or corrupt politicians? Some of them would have plenty of friends and family to help with the branch stacking and benefit from their relative or friend becoming a politician.

Obviously the people you know are different to mine. I can NOT imagine any of my associates doing such a thing and recklessly putting themselves in danger of a time in the Nik.

How do you fit people "I know" into the equation? Politicians have been caught branch stacking in the past - but only by chance.

You know what I mean, Mantra, stop trying me on.

Stop being so hostile. I heard the results on the news. I've made no suppositions.

Hostile, who me? What news? There is no FORMAL RESULT to the ACT Election ... not until all the votes and preferences have been counted, The Hare Clare system is something that even Antony Green has a PROBLEM with predicting,

I gave you some information but you still think the newspapers know best.

What has happened, Mantra, is that the GREENS have been decimated in Labor Canberra ....... suck that up.

[mantra]

For starters the person in control of each booth knows how many people should be voting at the booth and all up in the election any noticeable variability would be questioned. I have already pointed out the only way you can really cheat an election.

I don't see how they could. They might get an average, but this is not reliable as the demographics change in various areas which are constantly developing more shops and homes.

Most ballots are not won by the odd vote... if they are they are usually challenged and a recount takes place.
You are supposed to vote in PENCIL. Because that is what they provide.

People counting ballots are watched by scrutineers from each party, mistakes in counting, challenges to invalids or even an attempt to cheat (by rubbing out and altering a number) would in all honesty be seen.

Rubbing out votes wouldn't be an easy option. There are other ways. Prior to any federal election and sometimes state or local, there are people going around door to door spruiking for their party. In some instances they could make assumptions or actually confirm who might not be able to vote, particularly in areas where there are a lot of elderly people. Obtaining names and addresses is the easy part and with some luck on your side you could get away with it. There is no point going into the nitty gritty details of how it can be done, because it might give someone the wrong idea.

The ALP are known to have dead people vote for them. Even so there are not enough dead people voting to change the outcome of an election.

The ALP are not discreet or clever in their corruption. Perhaps the Libs are smarter. Twelve dead people voting at 12 different booths by 12 different people......it all helps. Try some other variations...and you could easily get a few hundred, maybe a few thousand extra votes.

[Rorschach]

I don't see how they could. They might get an average, but this is not reliable as the demographics change in various areas which are constantly developing more shops and homes.

After every election they know how many people voted there, they know down to a handful of people who should have voted there. If suddenly it's a hundred over then they know somethings wrong. The first thing they check is absentee votes. They can also communicate with other booths to see if it is a trend.
People except those voting absent usually go to the exact same booth every election in fact they are told which booth is closest when they register and where they should be voting. Mostly this is exactly what people do, the figures hardly vary.

There are reasons to go into how it can be done... because mostly it isn't done. Mostly the commission knows how it can be done and they have already taken actions to prevent or catch it.

A few hundred over votes would see the Commission checking for duplicate votes. But only if it would effect the outcome.

[Neferti]

YAWN ...... Mantra is (I think) insinuating that somebody has been fiddling with the Green Votes.

[Rorschach]

mantra has a tendency towards the paranoid and delusional.
perhaps she reads too many conspiracy stories.
I'm just trying to help her understand what actually goes on.

[mantra]

mantra has a tendency towards the paranoid and delusional.
perhaps she reads too many conspiracy stories.
I'm just trying to help her understand what actually goes on.

You have a tendency towards being unimaginative, monotonous and pompous. I take little notice of what you say because most of it is based on the opinions of biased RW journalists who have passed their used by date - although you try to pass their rubbish off as either fact or your own findings. You appear to have an unrealistic perception of yourself as being rational and knowledgeable. I try to ignore you.