Compulsory Voting - YES or NO?

[Rorschach]

I think the argument that being compelled to vote skews the result of a flawed argument and the sort of position I expect from upper class twits who think they know what is good for the population.

Rorschach are you an upper class twit?

Oh that's just a baseless flame, surely you can do better than that. I don't believe I've insulted you once. Yet you seem incapable of rendering me the same courtesy. On a couple of topics now.
My opinion SN comes from many years of experience.

I did provide someone else's opinion to open the debate you know.
I don't agree with them.

As boxy and I have both stated... in Australia we have compulsory voting in name only. But as I know from experience, we have a very low informal vote and many vote simply because they are there and not because they have a particular opinion or knowledge of the issues. They are only there because they HAVE TO VOTE. Rusted-ons only vote one way all their life. IMO they are less than useless. Many rusted-on Labor voters have told me they wouldn't vote if it wasn't compulsory. A reason labor will never vote for non-compulsion.

My issue with the compulsion to vote is twofold. It is not an exercise in true democracy and it can lead to a distortion in the vote that is undemocratic in itself.

As for, Only men voting.... should I tell you how many Men I have seen tell their wives or girlfriends who to vote for? Should I tell you of the ethnic group that votes as a block because of their fellow ethnics... 2 quick examples... an African guy putting up posters and setting up before polling for Labor, because he thought he had to do it for them letting him in the country. The Filipino enclave in a certain suburb voting Labor because many of the women were married to older men who just happen to belong to the Labor Party.

[Super Nova]

Oh that's just a baseless flame, surely you can do better than that. I don't believe I've insulted you once. Yet you seem incapable of rendering me the same courtesy. On a couple of topics now.

I sincerely appologise. I thought you could handle a little piss taking. I rarely come out and insult anyone (except those who are obvious). If you don't like it I could refrain in any piss taking in your direction.

Or... you could go with the sprit of the forum and take a little and not get offended. I choose not to be offended here unless I choose to be offended to make a point.

My opinion SN comes from many years of experience.

I did provide someone else's opinion to open the debate you know.
I don't agree with them.

As boxy and I have both stated... in Australia we have compulsory voting in name only. But as I know from experience, we have a very low informal vote and many vote simply because they are there and not because they have a particular opinion or knowledge of the issues. They are only there because they HAVE TO VOTE. Rusted-ons only vote one way all their life. IMO they are less than useless. Many rusted-on Labor voters have told me they wouldn't vote if it wasn't compulsory. A reason labor will never vote for non-compulsion.

My issue with the compulsion to vote is twofold. It is not an exercise in true democracy and it can lead to a distortion in the vote that is undemocratic in itself.

I think the compusory vote is the reason we have the large turnout. I think that is important for the reasons in the FOR arguement I posted from Wiki.

As for, Only men voting.... should I tell you how many Men I have seen tell their wives or girlfriends who to vote for? Should I tell you of the ethnic group that votes as a block because of their fellow ethnics... 2 quick examples... an African guy putting up posters and setting up before polling for Labor, because he thought he had to do it for them letting him in the country. The Filipino enclave in a certain suburb voting Labor because many of the women were married to older men who just happen to belong to the Labor Party.

I definitely was taking the piss mate. You're points are well made.

[Rorschach]

SN.... I don't see the point in insulting people just for the sake of it.
I don't put you in the same category I'd put Aussie in for instance.
I don't need making more enemies on the Net believe me. It gets oh so tedious having to flame back all the time, when you can just have a debate about the facts and not get overly personal. That's how I prefer it.
I don't mind us disagreeing I just think we can do it without the animus.

I think the compusory vote is the reason we have the large turnout. I think that is important for the reasons in the FOR arguement I posted from Wiki.

That's obvious. Not that the fine is too burdensome.
I think the for and against are both flawed in Wiki.
But I don't think getting a big turnout, when voting really isn't compulsory, is a good reason for it to remain so. I think unlike the US, Australians will vote, but I think people should be given the right to decide not to if the don't like any of the alternatives. That might actually make the parties try harder to be relevant and responsive to the public.

[Super Nova]

Well I don't see you as my enemy and I shall be more sensitive to you in future.

I think unlike the US, Australians will vote, but I think people should be given the right to decide not to if the don't like any of the alternatives. That might actually make the parties try harder to be relevant and responsive to the public.

I disagree. The for and against argument is pretty cleasr in my view.

For example, the parties would have to spend more money to get people out to vote. If people don't like the alternatives is not a reason not to vote, generally they don't like to 2 or 3 mainstream alternatives... gives the small parties a look in... like the greens have done. It can lead to unrest if too many fel they have no control over who gets in, at least with a vote they have had their say.

The only argument that adds up is your point that I should be free to choose.

Sometimes freedoms liek this should be overridden by the needs of the whole.

As Spock said. It is logical. The needs of the many outweigh... Kirk: ...the needs of the few. Captain Spock: Or the one.

[mantra]

SN.... I don't see the point in insulting people just for the sake of it.

Why do you do it then? Nearly every post directed to me, Aussie and occasionally others is full of insults such as moron, dopey, paranoid delusional, idiot, obsessive wanker, half-wit, pest, fcukwit, pompous blowhard etc. You squeal when someone insults you though.

As far as compulsory voting goes - it does encourage people to think. Can you imagine the extremists who would come out of the woodwork and exploit the system if it wasn't compulsory?

What's the problem with rusted ons or those who make up their mind at the last minute? Even those who give a donkey vote are entitled to that.

On many occasions you have said that I shouldn't be allowed to vote - a gross insult - so what makes your vote so much more important than anyone else's?

[Neferti]

If you don't want to vote, nobody is making you. Just don't turn up and wait for the $20 fine in the mail. I did that once many years ago. It was a by-election in Canberra. I didn't bother going along (on purpose to test the system) and got a fine of $20 in the mail a couple of weeks later. They threatened to take me to Court if I didn't pay up by a certain time. Just wrote them a cheque. $20 is a piddling amount to pay for lack of interest in voting.

I think it being compulsory to put your name on the Electoral Roll is a great idea. No need to vote if you don't want to.

[Rorschach]

Why do you do it then? Nearly every post directed to me, Aussie and occasionally others is full of insults such as moron, dopey, paranoid delusional, idiot, obsessive wanker, half-wit, pest, fcukwit, pompous blowhard etc. You squeal when someone insults you though.

That's bullshit mantra.
I only started flaming you back after you got upset because I contradicted your rot.
You started it I'll end it.

I note, even now your first words are to attack the person not the issue.

Why do you do it then? Nearly every post directed to me, Aussie and occasionally others is full of insults such as moron, dopey, paranoid delusional, idiot, obsessive wanker, half-wit, pest, fcukwit, pompous blowhard etc. You squeal when someone insults you though.

yawn... oh that's right Aussie always refers to me by name and is never insulting or aggressive. You mantra always come on personal a with your hissy fits. Always. I let many of your personal attacks go b4 I started to flame back at you.

As far as compulsory voting goes - it does encourage people to think. Can you imagine the extremists who would come out of the woodwork and exploit the system if it wasn't compulsory?

No, can you explain why they would?

What's the problem with rusted ons or those who make up their mind at the last minute? Even those who give a donkey vote are entitled to that.

oh dear, rusted-ons always vote the same way, therefore political parties assume they have their votes and don't have to work for it. Rusted-ons vote the same way generation after generation without considering issues or policies and therefore when situations change their votes never do, they do not vote for the good of the country, they vote for the good of the party. If you don't make your mind up till the last minute and we are being exact here mantra, you probably haven't been giving politics and the future of your country much thought at all. A donkey vote is valid in that someone cannot decide or does not know who to vote for and votes invalid, but mindlessly voting 1/2/3/4... is distorting the vote.

On many occasions you have said that I shouldn't be allowed to vote - a gross insult - so what makes your vote so much more important than anyone else's?

No it's my opinion of you as a voter. You claim one thing and always end up voting the same way. Your knowledge and interest on many issues is shallow, flawed or right out of a conspiracy book. I've never said my vote is more important than anyone else's. There you go getting personal again. In fact I have pointed out many times that my vote is wasted because I live in a safe seat.

[Rorschach]

I've always found it a bit Big Brother to compel people to vote then punish them if they don't Neferti.

[Neferti]

I've always found it a bit Big Brother to compel people to vote then punish them if they don't Neferti.

Probably. How about the Electoral Office losing my name off the Roll every so often? It has happened several times even though I have lived at the same address for eons! Turn up to have my name marked off the Roll and it isn't on it. Next time I have to vote, it is there, then another few years down the track it is missing off the Roll, again! They can't fine me if my name is left off the Roll. If it happens to be the Federal Election I would kick up a stink and demand that I do vote but if it is the ACT rubbish, I just say "Oh well" and walk off.

[mantra]

Why do you do it then? Nearly every post directed to me, Aussie and occasionally others is full of insults such as moron, dopey, paranoid delusional, idiot, obsessive wanker, half-wit, pest, fcukwit, pompous blowhard etc. You squeal when someone insults you though.

That's bullshit mantra.
I only started flaming you back after you got upset because I contradicted your rot.
You started it I'll end it.

I note, even now your first words are to attack the person not the issue.

Just giving you some of your own medicine back.

Why do you do it then? Nearly every post directed to me, Aussie and occasionally others is full of insults such as moron, dopey, paranoid delusional, idiot, obsessive wanker, half-wit, pest, fcukwit, pompous blowhard etc. You squeal when someone insults you though.

yawn... oh that's right Aussie always refers to me by name and is never insulting or aggressive. You mantra always come on personal a with your hissy fits. Always. I let many of your personal attacks go b4 I started to flame back at you.

Aussie is only being convivial when he calls you ratsak. Take it in good humour. Just responding or defending an issue is a flame according to you. I assume flame is slang for inflame.

As far as compulsory voting goes - it does encourage people to think. Can you imagine the extremists who would come out of the woodwork and exploit the system if it wasn't compulsory?

No, can you explain why they would?

For example in a queue at a booth - sometimes you can convince a couple of people waiting to vote for your favourite political party, but instead of convincing genuine voters who to vote for - you would have branch stackers fraudulently using the thousands, perhaps millions of unused votes for their own devious purpose.

What's the problem with rusted ons or those who make up their mind at the last minute? Even those who give a donkey vote are entitled to that.

oh dear, rusted-ons always vote the same way, therefore political parties assume they have their votes and don't have to work for it. Rusted-ons vote the same way generation after generation without considering issues or policies and therefore when situations change their votes never do, they do not vote for the good of the country, they vote for the good of the party. If you don't make your mind up till the last minute and we are being exact here mantra, you probably haven't been giving politics and the future of your country much thought at all. A donkey vote is valid in that someone cannot decide or does not know who to vote for and votes invalid, but mindlessly voting 1/2/3/4... is distorting the vote.

Surely rusted ons on both sides of the political spectrum would equal out to laziness for both major parties? How do you know rusted ons don't consider issues or policies - that's an assumption on your part as usual. As far as voting for the good of the party - isn't that what our pms have always spruiked - "it's for the good of the party". No major political party gives a stuff about the country - that's obvious.

On many occasions you have said that I shouldn't be allowed to vote - a gross insult - so what makes your vote so much more important than anyone else's?

No it's my opinion of you as a voter. You claim one thing and always end up voting the same way. Your knowledge and interest on many issues is shallow, flawed or right out of a conspiracy book. I've never said my vote is more important than anyone else's. There you go getting personal again. In fact I have pointed out many times that my vote is wasted because I live in a safe seat.

I have always challenged the policies of all the parties - even the Greens. If I end up voting the same way it's because one party is not as bad as the rest of them. So what if you think my knowledge is shallow, flawed or involving a conspiracy - it is my right to express my opinion whether you like it or not - oh and vote also.