The recessions already here

Australian Federal, State and Local Politics
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billy the kid
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Re: The recessions already here

Post by billy the kid » Thu Aug 29, 2019 9:16 pm

Black Orchid wrote:
Thu Aug 29, 2019 5:59 pm
Read this today ...
Australia’s economy is reaching crisis point — but instead of springing into action, the government is reverting to its old “absurd obsession”.

Australia’s economy is in a spot of bother. Let us count the ways:

• A trade war threatening the economies of our two biggest trading partners.

• Monstrous levels of household debt combined with pitiful wages growth.

• Unemployment and underemployment stuck too high to generate wages growth.

• A Reserve Bank slashing interest rates to record lows and talking about bringing in quantitative easing.

What we need from the government is a bit of oomph. A spending push to keep the cycle of earning and spending going. Instead we’re going to get … a surplus? How can that possibly be a good idea?

Australia has an absurd surplus obsession based on a misreading of what former Treasurer Peter Costello did in the 2000s. Costello was Treasurer during a time when money was coming in hand over fist. So much money that Treasury was continually surprised how much there was.

The economy was in amazing shape and the Treasurer was able to throw money at lots of things. He brought in a baby bonus, gave away huge tax cuts, made massive increases in defence spending, and was still able to run surpluses big enough to pay off the Government debt. Paying off the debt wasn’t necessarily seen as a big priority back then. It was just something to do with all that money.

But of course after the debt was paid off, the Treasurer claimed his run of surpluses as an important achievement. A singular triumph of sheer discipline. (Scant discipline was required, money was going everywhere in those days.)

Lo and behold the idea stuck. Now apparently we have to aim to get back to surplus every year. As though the big problem facing the country was our government debt, not our household debt.

Peter Costello and his Prime Minister John Howard were not stupid. They did not run a surplus in the bad times. That would be insane. They ran a surplus because the times were bountiful. They presided over a giant and unforeseen run of economic good fortune.

‘WORST SURPLUS EVER’

In the most recent Budget, though, Australia’s Treasurer announced a surplus. The 2019-20 surplus is projected to be $7.1 billion, and with the recent high price of iron ore, it could be even more.

Let’s just say it. This is the wrong time for a surplus. The wrong time for the government to be taking money out of the economy and using it to pay down debt. The economy needs all the money going around it can get. This is the worst surplus ever.

This is not to say the surplus is as fat as it might be. When I asked if this was the right time to be running a surplus, the Treasurer promptly pointed to all the spending the government has been doing.

“Conscious of the economic challenges we face, we set out in the Budget a pro-growth strategy with $158 billion of tax cuts, our $100 billion infrastructure plan and the creation of 80,000 apprenticeships,” Mr Frydenberg said, acknowledging the importance of this kind of stimulus. But of course, the surplus is also part of the boast.

“This economic plan also includes restoring the nation’s finances by returning the budget to the surplus for the first time in more than a decade.”

HOW TO SPEND IT

There’s two ways to feed a surplus back into the economy. Tax cuts or spending.

Spending is good. It can be used to set up a country for the future, for example by investing in infrastructure. The RBA has practically been begging the Government to announce a bit more infrastructure spending to both keep the economy going and set us up for the future. Anyone who has sat in traffic recently can probably think of some projects worth funding.

There’s plenty of schools and hospitals that could use a funding boost too. But the current government might see a spending splurge as a bit of ‘a Labor idea’. Luckily they have a good alternative. LMITO — the low and middle income tax offset.

That’s the tax cut that gave most middle income earners $1080 back at the end of last financial year. (Despite the name, the LMITO doesn’t do awfully much for low income earners. The full $1080 offset is only for people earning more than $48,000)

The Government announced the LMITO in the most recent Budget and the Reserve Bank, which has for some time felt like the only institution doing anything at all to juice up the economy of this country, fell on it with glee. The LMITO was likely to increased consumer disposable income by 0.6 per cent, the RBA said, which should flow into consumer spending.

The LMITO is a good idea. It takes money that could be going to the surplus and gives it back to people to spend. That’s not to say it’s better than investing for the future, or spending on solving social problems — two types of spending which would also prop up the economy — but it is an effective and non-controversial way to keep the economy ticking.

BUT IS IT ENOUGH?

The problem is the LMITO is only worth a few billion dollars a year. Probably not enough to jolt the economy out of the doldrums. If this government wanted to find a good and politically acceptable way to pump a bit more money back into the economy — at a time when the economy desperately needs it — they could crank up the LMITO. If things get bad, and they’re worried stimulus cheques seem too much like a Kevin Rudd manoeuvre — they could possibly even send out stimulus cheques and just call them LMITO advances.

The Treasurer has said he is willing to take “the necessary actions” to keep the economy going, if needed. The question is whether he’d be willing to give up his surplus by taking those actions. He should. Because he will deserve very little credit for bringing down a surplus in an era of economic weakness.
https://www.news.com.au/finance/economy ... db91043af6
The helicopter money (LMITO) has already begun.
Unfortunately helicopter money wont work if everything keeps on going up.
We have already seen the ATO increase the price of beer, and as petrol prices continue
to rise giving more and more tax to the government, they are simply taking the helicopter
money back from us. Its only a matter of time before other commodities go up, and guess what
all the helicopter money will be gone.
AND I also noticed today that Cormann stated that the compulsory superannuation levy will go up in
2021. This is ludicrous. How can they say this when its so far away, and Australia is already in a recession.
This will cost employers even more to employ their workers.
How can this increase be planned so far ahead. This is madness.
And while this happens, a packet of Australian biscuits sold by Woolworths costs
$3.20...whilst the same packet costs 90c at Aldi.
Merchandise imported from the other side of the world continues to sell in Aldi at half the
price of the Australian product sold by Woolworths and Coles.
Of course we have to continue to pander to overseas countries and interests.
This recession will not go away until the incompetent government pours money into
infrastructure.
We cant just rely on selling our rocks.
It wasnt that long ago that people were laughing at the thought of a recession.
There werent any media articles at all.
Then they began..just one here and one there...
These days...articles about a recession are appearing quite regularly.
It has taken a while for the penny to drop.
The government will continue to bullshit to us.
They will continue to lie.
Make no mistake...the recession has arrived...
AND it will get worse....
The RBA meet next week and will make an announcement about interest rates.
I anticipate another reduction in rates, but as the RBA is pretty much incompetent, I wouldnt be surprised if Lowe sits on his hands again....
Morrison, Cormann, Frydenberg and the rest of them will continue with their facadism, all the while, tripping
all over the world on their junkets....while the peons continue to struggle…..
AND Rudd continues to test the waters for a return to politics due to the incompetent Shorten/Albanese fiasco.....
It just gets better and better doesn't it...…. :rofl :rofl :rofl
To discover those who rule over you, first discover those who you cannot criticize...Voltaire
Its coming...the rest of the world versus islam....or is it here already...

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billy the kid
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Re: The recessions already here

Post by billy the kid » Wed Sep 04, 2019 12:32 pm

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-04/ ... 9/11474470

Blind Freddie can see that graph is trending lower and lower....
Yet our incompetent leaders just continue to sit on their hands and do nothing.....
Morrison goes to church....Trad junkets around the world...
Rudd (testing the waters for a return to politics) plays handball like a child seeking attention...
Palletcheck bumbles her way through the Trad fiasco...
Lowe does nothing but criticize the government...
Cormann says the compulsory super levy will go up in 2021...
BUT.... wait for it....tax cuts will come in...when....2024/5....thats five years away.....
Meanwhile, back at the ranch, the Aussie dollar slips to it lowest level since the GFC, and the
financial experts are telling us the real estate slump has bottomed out....yeah right...

Australia...leading the way....... :rofl :rofl :rofl
To discover those who rule over you, first discover those who you cannot criticize...Voltaire
Its coming...the rest of the world versus islam....or is it here already...

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billy the kid
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Re: The recessions already here

Post by billy the kid » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:25 am

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-08/ ... t/11487524

AND yet the real estate experts are telling us that several areas in Australia will boom between now and
2022.....yeah right....pigs might fly too....
The government continues to tell blatant lies about the economy, stating as per usual that our fundamentals
are sound etc etc....
Morrison, Frydenberg, Cormann, Lowe...what a bunch of lying fools we have leading this country.....
How the fuck did this mob get voted back in.......
We can only assume that Shorten and his cohorts as an alternative...stunk like a polecat....

Aaah well...at least we won a cricket match last nite.... :rofl
To discover those who rule over you, first discover those who you cannot criticize...Voltaire
Its coming...the rest of the world versus islam....or is it here already...

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Neferti
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Re: The recessions already here

Post by Neferti » Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:56 pm

Years ago, I spent 3 months on "secondment" at the Department of Housing, attached to their area that supplied housing information to the ABS. I was working along side Economists and, not knowing much about that subject, got talking to the guys. I was informed that The Housing Market "fluctuates" ... and it does ... one quarter, say, housing in Victoria is "on the rise" whereas housing in Sydney is on a "downturn" and housing in Brisbane is "stagnant" .... next quarter .... Victoria is "stagnant", Sydney is still on a "downturn" and Brisbane is going great guns.

Your local Real Estate Agent hasn't a clue and all he/she is worried about is their $.

Sell in a "sellers market" and buy in a "buyers market" ... or stay where you are. :thumb

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billy the kid
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Re: The recessions already here

Post by billy the kid » Sat Sep 28, 2019 1:10 pm

I see the talking heads are telling us that the tax cuts planned for some years ahead might be brought forward
to next year.....
But but but....I thought our fundamentals were sound....
I thought our economy was going gangbusters....
I thought the experts were telling us that some areas are going to boom next year in real
estate prices....
Arent they talking about bringing down interest rates again in October, and possibly again
in November....
But but but...I thought our fundamentals were sound.....
Certain talking heads were actually saying on their blogs to ignore all talk of a recession...…. :rofl
I see Trump is talking about "de-listing some Chinese companies from the Dow..."
That'll thrown the cat amongst the pigeons wont it.............. :rofl
Aaah well....who's going to win the footy...……………... :rofl
To discover those who rule over you, first discover those who you cannot criticize...Voltaire
Its coming...the rest of the world versus islam....or is it here already...

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Redneck
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Re: The recessions already here

Post by Redneck » Wed Oct 02, 2019 9:40 am

I seem to recall some Trump fan on here telling us what a great job Trump has done and the USA economy was going gangbusters!

Seems they had their orange coloured glasses on


https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-10-02/ ... y/11566216


US President Donald Trump has used his favourite social media platform Twitter to take another swipe at the Federal Reserve and its chairman Jerome Powell.

"As I predicted, Jay Powell and the Federal Reserve have allowed the [US] Dollar to get so strong, especially relative to ALL other currencies, that our manufacturers are being negatively affected," Mr Trump tweeted on Tuesday (local time).

"Fed Rate too high. They are their own worst enemies, they don't have a clue. Pathetic!"

Mr Trump has made several online posts in the past few months insulting the independent Fed and its chief, who he personally appointed.

The President even impugned Mr Powell's loyalty for not cutting US interest rates aggressively enough, questioning who the "greater enemy" was — the Fed chairman or Chinese President Xi Jinping.


Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump
As I predicted, Jay Powell and the Federal Reserve have allowed the Dollar to get so strong, especially relative to ALL other currencies, that our manufacturers are being negatively affected. Fed Rate too high. They are their own worst enemies, they don’t have a clue. Pathetic!


What sparked Mr Trump's latest outburst was new data revealing US manufacturing activity had contracted sharply, recording its worst result in more than 10 years.

This also stoked investors' fears of a worsening global economic slowdown, exacerbated by Mr Trump's ongoing trade war with China, triggering a Wall Street sell-off overnight.

The Institute for Supply Management's latest figures showed US factory activity fell to 47.8 in September, its weakest result since June 2009.

A reading below 50 indicates contraction in the manufacturing sector and is not a good sign for the economy.

September's reading marked the second-straight month that the index fell below the 50 threshold. The index has now declined for six consecutive months.








.

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billy the kid
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Re: The recessions already here

Post by billy the kid » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:23 am

Redneck wrote:
Wed Oct 02, 2019 9:40 am
I seem to recall some Trump fan on here telling us what a great job Trump has done and the USA economy was going gangbusters!

Seems they had their orange coloured glasses on


https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-10-02/ ... y/11566216


US President Donald Trump has used his favourite social media platform Twitter to take another swipe at the Federal Reserve and its chairman Jerome Powell.

"As I predicted, Jay Powell and the Federal Reserve have allowed the [US] Dollar to get so strong, especially relative to ALL other currencies, that our manufacturers are being negatively affected," Mr Trump tweeted on Tuesday (local time).

"Fed Rate too high. They are their own worst enemies, they don't have a clue. Pathetic!"

Mr Trump has made several online posts in the past few months insulting the independent Fed and its chief, who he personally appointed.

The President even impugned Mr Powell's loyalty for not cutting US interest rates aggressively enough, questioning who the "greater enemy" was — the Fed chairman or Chinese President Xi Jinping.


Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump
As I predicted, Jay Powell and the Federal Reserve have allowed the Dollar to get so strong, especially relative to ALL other currencies, that our manufacturers are being negatively affected. Fed Rate too high. They are their own worst enemies, they don’t have a clue. Pathetic!


What sparked Mr Trump's latest outburst was new data revealing US manufacturing activity had contracted sharply, recording its worst result in more than 10 years.

This also stoked investors' fears of a worsening global economic slowdown, exacerbated by Mr Trump's ongoing trade war with China, triggering a Wall Street sell-off overnight.

The Institute for Supply Management's latest figures showed US factory activity fell to 47.8 in September, its weakest result since June 2009.

A reading below 50 indicates contraction in the manufacturing sector and is not a good sign for the economy.

September's reading marked the second-straight month that the index fell below the 50 threshold. The index has now declined for six consecutive months.








.
:thumb
Just received an email from the CEC...rather than cut and paste the details, everyone should visit their website
to remain conversant with the impending collapse of world economies...
Glass Steagall legislation is needed to rescue depositors from a bail in.....
To discover those who rule over you, first discover those who you cannot criticize...Voltaire
Its coming...the rest of the world versus islam....or is it here already...

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brian ross
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Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:26 pm

Re: The recessions already here

Post by brian ross » Sun Oct 20, 2019 8:25 pm

Nationalism is not to be confused with patriotism. - Eric Blair

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brian ross
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Re: The recessions already here

Post by brian ross » Tue Oct 22, 2019 7:39 pm

Government's coveted budget surplus could be slipping away, according to some economists

Means that, if it comes to pass, ScoMo's own assessment of the success of his government will not be correct (but he can always blame the drought!)

MYEFO will have to have some "stings" if they are to drag it back into line....

(Given that there seems to be more Friedmanites in Government than Keynesians, it is like that their determination for a surplus may make any downturn worse rather than better - similar to the 1930's ) :roll: :roll:
Nationalism is not to be confused with patriotism. - Eric Blair

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